Comment by mkolodny

5 years ago

I agree.

The question is, if it's hard to figure out who you can trust, then who can you trust to decide what's fact and what's fiction?

I think trusting any one person or organization to decide is dangerous. Everyone has biases, including the people making decisions at Twitter.

I'd prefer to see the arguments for both sides clearly laid out - "Here are the arguments for and against". Ideally anyone would be able to contribute to either side. Maybe giving each argument its own HN-style discussion.

4 comments

mkolodny

matwood 5 years ago

Everyone has biases, including the people making decisions at Twitter.

Sure, but many things being discussed are beyond biases at this point. POTUS tweets and says completely false things every single day. This isn't downplaying things he disagrees with or spinning, it's flat out lying and/or denying they even exist.

There was a long thread here on HN about HCQ, and some were asking for proof that HCQ does not work. No, that is completely the opposite of how science, and drug research in particularly, works. Drugs are considered non-working until proven otherwise and never the other way around.

I understand what you're saying, but I shouldn't have to prove 1+1=2 every time I want to have a discussion. Let's take vaccines for example. They have been proven safe and effective many times over. They do not cause autism. In this case, what is the other side of the argument? On my side it's tons of peer reviewed research and on the other it's a few quacks with falsified/misinterpreted/unreplicable/bad science. What is there to actually argue? This is where I normally get frustrated because there are so many topics that can be vigorously argued in good faith, but if we can't agree to some basic 'this is how the scientific method works' then what's the point.

jungletime 5 years ago
I support vaccination because on aggregate they're best bang for buck in medicine that we have.
The most compelling argument I heard from detractors is that a) Vaccines have been tested/developed on people in Africa who were not told of the dangers of experimental treatments
b)Some vaccines contain trace amounts of metals like mercury.
Both a and b are True. In what way is the person that holds such views unscientific.
When I was child, I was literally vaccinated with a re-used needle. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.
I don't understand why you can act like vaccines have never hurt anyone ever, and claim it as the scientific view. To me this seems equally as absurd.
- matwood 5 years ago
  
  > a) Vaccines have been tested/developed on people in Africa who were not told of the dangers of experimental treatments
  Running medical trials on unsuspecting people is wrong whether it's a new drug or vaccine. It also has little to do with the well proven safety vaccines.
  > b)Some vaccines contain trace amounts of metals like mercury.
  Ah, the classic anti-vax 'toxins' argument. I said that vaccines have been proven safe time and again (which they have). I never said they don't have trace amounts of stuff often found in much larger amounts all around us in the environment [1].
  > When I was child, I was literally vaccinated with a re-used needle. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.
  There was a time in not so long ago medical history that things like needles were reused. It wasn't specific to vaccines.
  > I don't understand why you can act like vaccines have never hurt anyone ever, and claim it as the scientific view
  Talk about moving/making up goal posts. Nowhere did I claim that no one was ever hurt in the history of figuring out how vaccines work. What I claimed is that vaccines today have been proven safe over and over again. They also do not cause autism.
  [1] https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/

root_axis 5 years ago

> I think trusting any one person or organization to decide is dangerous. Everyone has biases, including the people making decisions at Twitter.

Then don't do that. People shouldn't treat Twitter as the highest source if truth, but I don't think anyone does.