Comment by reincoder
2 years ago
Thousands of people live in a zip code, while hundreds and thousands of people live in a city. We are literally giving away that data for free through our API and database. The creepiness of IP geolocation is mostly a meme.
IP geolocation is mainly used in cybersecurity and marketing analytics. There are many ways to geolocate someone. I once came across a project that could estimate the country a user is from based on their writing style and grammar mistakes. For example, American people sometimes use "should of" instead of "should have". Knowing the geolocation of an IP address isn't super creepy. It's just how things work on the internet.
And you're literally advertising this project as being helpful for targeted ads. So it's pretty clear from the get go that what you consider creepy isn't what I consider creepy. And having done enough reidentification work to scare myself, "thousands of people" might as well be a couple dozen or less. I get why you're defensive and why you think it's not creepy, but calling it a "meme" is insultingingly dismissive.
Just because it's "how things work on the internet" doesn't make its mass collection right. Under the same logic, any side channel attack is just "how it works", and its abuse warrants no ethical question.
I grok and understand your concern. I am not being defensive; I am just trying to provide an explanation. I really enjoy having conversations like this with developers as honestly and empathetically possible.
I apologize if I was rude in any way by saying the word "meme". I saw a sister comment and thought you were being sarcastic. There is a popular meme about "I have your IP address", so I thought you were referencing that. I have had conversations with many young people who were concerned about their IP address being leaked through a game server. Therefore, I try to use humor to alleviate their stress. However, I now realize that this situation was different, and I am sorry for not understanding that.
We provide a service that helps users keep their internet-connected services secure by providing IP metadata information. Are you being attacked by malicious actors? Use our free IP database to identify the location and ASN to block them. Do you want to restrict access to your service to certain regions? Do that for free with our services.
We have the most accurate data available, and yet we offer the most generous free tier. We provide a full accuracy IP database for free, without any range aggregation, and with daily updates and a commercially permissible license. We have built a community forum solely dedicated to answering users' questions. We invest in website tools and open-source tools, all with the goal of helping users maintain the security and functionality of their services.
We do have premium tier services, but if you use our free data as a foundation, you can always replicate those premium features to a reliable degree.
Our IP metadata information is being used in marketing and sales intelligence. It is the same data that you use to protect your internet connected devices, used by our customers to sell you something.
IP metadata information that we provide is a cornerstone of keeping the internet safe and accessible for everyone. That is how things just are. The deepweb is immune to IP meta data information, and that is why it is such a messy and chaotic place.
That is just truth of the internet. We are essential and we prefer to be open about our process and listen to our stakeholders (users + customers + non-users).
Thank you for the well thought out response. I disagree with just about everything you say, but I understand where you're coming from and I appreciate the validation that the use of a VPN is more important than it's ever been. As a professional courtesy: calling yourself "essential" is an enormous red flag and you might want to consider different phrasing.
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For sure. When people work in any industry long enough, it's easy to stop thinking about the basics. E.g., a retail butcher thinks of his work very differently than a cow or a vegan does.
When people work in advertising, they mostly forget that the core of their business is for-profit manipulation of people with little or no regard for truth or the people concerned. But I personally think that's kinda creepy, and only getting more so as it goes from broad manipulation of millions via mass media down to thousands, hundreds, or single individuals.
That is a good point. I will try to add some additional points to your statement.
In the context of a butcher and a vegan we are not either of them, we would be someone who sell salt. Salt as an ingredient is used by vegans, vegetarians, and meat eaters.
Salt is useful, and it is a complimentary item that makes the food taste better. But it is not a main feature of any dish. Salt plays an important and somewhat universally required item in any dish, but this is not the main feature of the dish you eat.
We are a data company. This IP metadata we sell is important to run a service that is connected to the internet. We are focused on serving cybersecurity as we are focused on other industries which includes adtech and sales intelligence.
IP metadata is used in threat intelligence, building firewalls, and attack surface management. On the other hand, when you are running a business at scale, you need to invest into understanding your target demographics. That is where largely adtech companies use our data. They need data and context to understand who their users are.
IP metadata helps to prevent cyberattacks to happen at a very early stage through firewall blocking. IP metadata, used through threat intelligence, can further strengthen firewalls to prevent future attacks. And IP metadata, can also be used in website personalization, adtech and sales intelligence etc.
We believe that every internet connected services for profit and non-profit alike, should have access to some security resilience, that is why we offer so many good quality free data.
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