← Back to context

Comment by Veserv

2 years ago

It should be very easy to add one without somebody noticing. This is the same Apple which shipped a version of macOS for months that added the ability to login to root with any password only a few years ago.

Their review processes are so incompetent even one of the most security critical components, root login, let a totally basic “fail your security 101 class” bug through. It is absolutely inexcusable to have a process that bad and is indicative of their overall approach. As they say, “one cockroach means an infestation”.

Mistakes happen but Apple's reputation for strong security is well deserved. They invest heavily and the complexity of this exploit chain is evidence of that. Linux has had its fair share of trivial root login exploits that somehow got through code review.

  • No, that is a level of error similar to delivering cars with no airbag in them for months. In any other industry that would indicate a unimaginable level of process failure. Only in commercial software are egregious, basic mistakes swept under the rug as “mistakes happen”.

    Just to list a few process failures off the top of my head.

    No proofs of specification conformance. No specification conformance tests. No specification. No regression testing. No regression testing of common failure modes. No testing of common failure modes. No enhanced review for critical components. No design conforming to criticality requirements. No criticality requirements. No intention to establish criticality requirements.

    In actual safety and security critical software development you do all of those except maybe the first. Doing none of them is rank incompetence and clear evidence you do not know the first thing about actual security that can protect against real professionals. And fancy that, Apple can not and never has against attackers with minimal resources like small teams with only a few million dollars.

    We can talk about a reputation for “strong” security when they can protect against the standard, commonplace 10M dollar attacks we see every day.

    • Uh, very few folks outside of Cupertino know better than Mike how much of a total shitshow Apple were a decade or more ago. His team had to deal with their insanity on a regular basis. : - )

      Since then, though, they have cleaned up their act (I've never been a fan). As a silly example, I'm pretty sure they finally check into source control the configuration of their networking equipment... Plus do a lot more to counteract the sophistication of today's nation-state attacks. They've come a long way since the hacks of 2014, when they had to scramble to enable 2FA for iCloud — previously used only for account changes or purchases. As for this vulnerability, it might be a plain bug or some NSA-style backdoor with plausible deniability, but we probably won't know which for years.

      1 reply →

  • Where do Apple have a reputation for strong security?

    Compared to other mainstream operating system, they seem to constantly be the last to introduce things like stack canaries, non executable memory segments, and all that which is considered best practice now.

I’m not trying to defend Apple but I think that line of thinking is pretty cynical and could be used to condemn basically any company or open source project that attracts enough interest for attackers.