Comment by bpt3
5 days ago
> I'm sorry, but I can't recall a single time it actually happened. Expressing support is important, but I never heard of it being mandatory.
I'm sorry, but it does happen. I've personally experienced it and witnessed it.
> And since pronouns are a big part of someone's identity, I'd say one should try to get them right, especially now that most of us made it easy to do (mine are he/him, BTW).
We should absolutely get it right, but they are not a big part of everyone's identity, which is a point missed by the people who feel it is an extremely large part of theirs and want everyone to know about it.
Pronouns are not a big part of any cis person’s identity because everything matches their identity. Trans people need to affirm their gender against what nature and society afforded them since they were born. It’s inconsiderate to ignore that.
That's their problem to deal with. And as we have seen repeatedly demonstrated in recent years, calling a male "she" is more likely to encourage him to violate women's boundaries and to give this an air of acceptability. This is why it's important not to accede to "preferred pronoun" requests, as it becomes a slippery slope to the erosion of women's rights.
> Pronouns are not a big part of any cis person’s identity because everything matches their identity.
So it's not everyone then.
> It’s inconsiderate to ignore that.
Who here is ignoring that?
I think this is a good example of what annoys people about "wokeness" (not speaking to the larger social dynamics nor the larger political atmosphere.)
I'm POC. Many people, even some really close friends of mine, don't know the primary language that I grew up using even though I speak, read, and write in English with an American accent. Some folks have used invented names to describe my primary language. Others don't know that someone who looks a lot like me doesn't speak the same primary language. It's annoying, sure. Sometimes it feels vaguely discriminatory. But I'm not going to get extremely angry about it, rant about it, or launch into attack over it. I generally smile a bit, correct them, and move on. I might then laugh at them a bit (gently) with some friends of the same ethnic background. Again I don't mind that much. It's the price we pay of living in a multicultural society, that to some extent we always understand yet misunderstand everyone else.
Now obviously some people use these styles of microagressions to discriminate or throw hate or prejudice at others. If you're reading a small snippet (like Twitter-alikes) or if you read something out of context, it can be hard to tell whether this person is prejudiced against you or is simply unaware. But generally in long-form online conversation or in face-to-face conversation, it becomes very obvious when people are prejudiced vs unaware. And sometimes there are borderline cases where you can't tell. This line is ill-defined, varies by situation, and often varies by person. Part of participating in a multicultural society is to find your line. For some folks it's a quick one: small microaggressions and you disengage. Others are fine to forgive and are open to more of these microaggressions.
I'm not saying this in the abstract. I have definitely gotten weird vibes from folks in conversations who kept tiptoeing around ethnic slurs. I trust my gut. I usually walk away from those conversations IRL or block the person online. I've also been racially harassed before in person, both as bullying when I was younger and just plain anti-ethnic behavior as an adult.
Constantly trying to be considerate to every minority group for every perceived grievance is exhausting and creates a chilling effect on speech. This is the problem with this form of "wokism." There's a different category of issues when this gets extrapolated into politics and large social issues that requires a much longer answer than this, but I hope my answer offers some insight.