Comment by ToucanLoucan
21 days ago
> You missed the point. It’s not objectively true in all situations that if you don’t believe fluorinating water is necessary that you’re an a-scientific bad faith actor.
That's not what was being debated. What was asserted was that fluoride in water lowers IQ, a position that has been so thoroughly debunked at this point, that if, much like being anti-vax or thinking climate change doesn't exist, any continued movement reinforcing it is almost by definition bad faith. The information exists and short of purposely going out and looking for contrarian nonsense relative to the established position of science on the subject, you and everyone else can find it.
As frustrating as it is that "do your own research" has been basically ruined as a phrase by the professional internet bullshitter industrial complex, you really should, with a nod to the need for critical analysis of sources, an important part of that that frequently gets left to the side.
> Your statements very strongly supposed that this is a solved case closed topic
Because it is, and we need more of that and less endless citation. Not because citation is impossible or bad, but because we don't need to keep arguing every last point. If you think certain things, like fluoride lowers IQ, or that climate change doesn't exist, you are not needing an intellectual rebuke, you're needing enough people making fun of you that you stop spouting horseshit and go learn about things. All of humanity's knowledge is at your fingertips. It is not the responsibility of reasonable people to educate you against your will.
I've never thought much about it as tap water tastes nasty to me, but it does seem like legit scientists are still studying the issue, as of 2023.[0] Course we over produce scientists and so much of science is low efficiency, but they're getting funding and being published none-the-less.
0 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S089203622...
I’m actually now much less certain that fluoride is unequivocally safe and newly skeptical of anybody arguing that anybody else questioning it, including effects on the brain, is a whacko. Thanks to down-thread links to the meta analysis from this year by the national toxicology program, it is crystal clear that high levels of fluoride ARE linked to lower IQ. It begs the question about working to better understand the effects of lower levels. Absolutely nothing presented thus far draws the conclusion that low levels of fluoride are safe, full stop. Thank you for changing my mind and making me look deeper, fervent fluoride supporters.
Maybe time to start making fun of the associated press then?
https://apnews.com/article/fluoride-water-brain-neurology-iq...
There are also other harmful side effects of fluoride, such as fluorosis, which I have. It’s not a huge deal, and I personally still think it’s a huge net positive, but people should be allowed to make their own decisions, and the science is far less settled than you claim, and not comparable at all to the debate over climate change.
I guess I (and probably the GGP) understood the response to be more general, picking out the IQ point as easily refutable therefore a short-circuit way to dismiss the broader narrative.