Comment by nemothekid
16 days ago
Unfortunately, it seems people can't or won't wrestle with the underlying issue. The underlying issue is complex, and it's easier to believe Americans are just too dumb to do voter ID.
I'm not explaining this just for you - but anyone else reading this post. Here is a video from Paul Weyrich, a highly influential republican, in the 1980s discussing why voter turn out should be reduced: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fR4wxlCGIu0
The symptoms are "trust in the system", "voter id" and "voter fraud". The PROBLEM is one major political party has found it extremely advantageous to ensure as few people vote as possible. If every American got voter ID tomorrow, republicans would simply invent a new issue to manufacture distrust in the system in order to suppress votes. Then another pakistani/european/canadian will be flabbergasted as to why American just don't do X and how all their friends do X everyday.
That's why I'm saying the problem is complex. You are viewing the problem as "Americans just won't adopt voter ID", and on it's face you are probably confused as to why a country as rich as America can't do Voter ID. What I'm saying the problem is that it is actually financially and politically advantageous for one party so sow distrust in the voting process (and this isn't some leftist conspiracy, this is openly admitted by them). Once you understand that you will see why Voter ID is so salient. It's not that we can't do Voter ID, its that Voter ID is the current boogeyman to sow distrust and if that is ever solved, we will simply invent a new problem in order to suppress voters.
As I mentioned to him above he is ignoring a gigantic issue with the voting system in Pakistan, one that disenfranchises a nonzero amount of people.
I am not ignoring it, That disenfranchisement is deliberate, and NOT as a consequence of voter-ID.
Our government and population WANT to disenfranchise them, we WANT to be bigoted against them, and if photo-ID didn't exist, voter rolls STILL exist and then we would use THOSE to lynch them or whatever.
This is hilarious. When it's YOUR government trying to disenfranchise voters, it's deliberate and you can understand that.
When it's America, then it's somehow different. I even laid it out for you clearly that republicans WANT to disenfranchise them, but your prescription is that we need a 25 year plan to offer photo IDs on the cheap.
>and if photo-ID didn't exist, voter rolls STILL exist and then we would use THOSE to lynch them or whatever.
The irony in telling Americans to build a 25 year plan to roll out photo ID when they don't even solve issues for your government. Do you not see how foolish it is to tell Americans to spend time solving a problem that YOU KNOW won't solve the issue of government targeted disenfranchisement? You wrote 500 odd words telling Americans to build a system you just admitted doesn't work to solve the underlying problem.
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You know they are on separate voting rolls (on paper) which they don’t validate.
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> If every American got voter ID tomorrow, republicans would simply invent a new issue to manufacture distrust in the system in order to suppress votes.
And?
I am sorry, you fear.... governing? Because that's what life is. You fix one issue, some other arises.
The issue is NOT complex, let's admit it... you just don't want to lose 'face'. You have hitched yourself to the no-ID bandwagon for so long it kills you to admit it was wrong.
Democrats are trying to pretend something is a civil rights issue which NO left-leaning politician the rest of the world considers it to be so. TRUST in the system is paramount, this why Trump is in the office, it seems american citizens trust him more than they trust democrats.
It's a governance/bureaucratic issue. But as the guest on Jon Stewart's podcast said[1], democrats just can't govern.
Any other person would think of it a 25-year plan and start NOW. Start small, start with the most democratic cities in democratic states, and start offering photo ID on the cheap, on the doorstep. Use all those taxes you collect for it. Then move on to other cities in the democratic state, then slowly move outward.
Maybe one day you will again hold the federal government and then you can use the learning from that to help implement it elsewhere... and even if red states don't implement, at least you will have started something good, and you will have something to PRESENT.
But don't mind me, I am just going to spend sometime just trying to understand how trump's tariffs affect us (29%!!!), I feel I will be facing some severe shortages soon.
[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi8IBAEpAd4
>You have hitched yourself to the no-ID bandwagon for so long it kills you to admit it was wrong.
Please explain to me clearly where I was wrong? What is the problem you have identified and the solution that I gave that was incorrect?
This rest of the text you posted is a massive non-sequitor. I identified to you that (1) there is no voter fraud problem (2) voter ID would not fix anything except cost the government more money and (3) it's a false claim made to disenfranchise voters.
Please clearly, explain whats wrong, backed with relevant data about voter fraud instead of waffling about Ezra Klein and John Stewart on a completely different issue.
>I am sorry, you fear.... governing?
I fear spending money trying to solve a made up problem. Something you pretended to care about when you brought up Ezra Klein. Except in the case of Voter ID you oppose Ezra Klein and you actually want to spend money doing bullshit that solves nothing. Please identify what is actually solved that is worth someone spending 25 years of their life handing out voter IDs.
> I fear spending money trying to solve a made up problem.
Ah I see.