Comment by fxwin
7 days ago
I don't think anyone has a problem with europe being a more independent player, it becoming a necessity is what people are upset about. I'd rather have germany make massive investments in infrastructure and health reform than its military.
This line of thinking is exactly what got us into this situation. If you want to outsource your defense how can you be surprised when you get ignored in the Ukraine discussions and when the US feels free to just annex parts of your territory. What's your recourse ?
The 'outsourcing' has always been for the benefit of US defence corporations.
There were a number of occasions in the 50s to 70s when the US stepped in directly to neuter world-leading aerospace projects in the UK, forcing the UK to buy from the US instead.
Virtually all of the cost of the UK's Trident deterrent goes to the US.
And it would be unwise to write off the EU, especially now there's a mass exodus of researchers from the US.
>There were a number of occasions in the 50s to 70s when the US stepped in directly to neuter world-leading aerospace projects in the UK, forcing the UK to buy from the US instead.
Exactly, and with the recent moves Trump administration is directly calling out EU to arm - so a good development in my book.
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> If you want to outsource your defense
It's not only that
Outsource defense to USA
Outsource production to China
Make yourself critically dependent on raw materials from Russia.
Exactly Europe is on a downward spiral into irrelevancy - Trump moves actually give the idea of a relevant EU space.
The same arguments can be made for free trade, and i think most would agree that the world is better off with international trade than without.
There is no free trade, EU was tariff heavy and protectionist since forever, in fact that's probably the primary motivator for creating it - a single European market where they get to control the imports. Trump is brash and escalating it suddenly but this game is not new.
I'm all in favor of Europe merging more tightly, scale brings a lot of benefits - moves Trump is making are forcing EU members in this direction where they otherwise wouldn't go so easily for petty interests.
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> This line of thinking is exactly what got us into this situation.
This is exactly right and it is insane that people don't see this. The dysfunction that Pax Americana has inflicted upon Europe must go away. A continent that cannot defend itself is not a sovereign continent.