Comment by cwillu
3 days ago
You can quite easily draw a line that society does not get to force someone to live a tormented existence in spite of their prior declaration that they do not want to be tormented.
“It shouldn't be that way” is not an excuse to torture people through your moralizing indifference to the fact that it is that way.
I've wondered about this for my hypothetical future self.
Currently? I'd say that I wouldn't want to live with dementia, but what if my "demented self" (kinda hate the phrasing, sorry) in the future wants to live, or doesn't remember they don't want to live?
Do I have a say over the life of someone who doesn't remember they were me?
You don’t have a say over your future you because your future you is not the same person as you.
That's what I lean towards, too.
The entire issue they're pointing to is that deciding that someone's existence is sufficiently tormented is difficult and morally fraught.
If you visit an elderly care home you'll find plenty of people who express their wish that they don't want to live any longer. It's not getting better for them - they are just waiting for the day to come, often in agony.
And don't you think the solution to that should be to not ship your parents to a care home rather than finishing the job by euthanizing them?
But do people who have dementia or say a mental illness have the capacity to make that decision?
It sounds like Daniel Kahneman was suffering from depression after his wife's death and all he saw in the rest of his life was sadness. He had no hope. What day was the best day to die? What if the next day his hope came back?
"What if the next day his hope came back?"
What if he tried that, but every day just got worse than the last day?
And people don't get any younger.
My grandmother is 98. She hates her life since she could not go out anymore. But she is catholic and suicide would be a mortal sin. So she waits till gods take her. And suffers till then.
I would make a different choice for sure. If life is hell and no one depends on me, why should I continue the suffering? (At the cost of others, if I would need help?)
But my plan is of course to reach 120+ in good health. But if I decide I had enough, it will be my decision.
> What if he tried that, but every day just got worse than the last day?
Anyone can say that about their life right now, can't they? How many people struggling today think that their life will get no better? Look at all those who made it through slavery, what hope did they have? Their hope came from their faith.
Suffering has a purpose, this is something your grandmother understands through her faith. Buddhists understand this as well. Maybe the problem is not our suffering, but our lack of faith in others and in in something bigger than ourselves.
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Why do you see depression? Note the article mentions a partner--he lost his wife but he had found someone else so I do not think this is a result of losing his wife.
I think it was this part that stuck out to me.
“His partner died in 2018 as a result of vascular dementia. The loss affected him deeply.”
I can see that loss affecting him even though he had a new partner. Depression does not always go away when you meet someone new.
But I think people with depression have lost hope in the future. And it sounds like he lost Hope in his future.
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