Comment by permo-w
7 hours ago
why are specifically the Danish so obsessed with pushing this through? it always seems to come back to them
7 hours ago
why are specifically the Danish so obsessed with pushing this through? it always seems to come back to them
Partly it's because the Danish have the rotating EU presidency at the moment so they have the job of pushing things forward (which also means receiving the most lobbying). In the previous wave earlier in the year, it was the Polish for the same reason.
Partly it's they don't have the same pro-privacy culture that say Germany and many of the eastern european countries have.
People also think the current Danish PM was also offended by a former prominent Danish politician and cabinet minister who was arrested for CSAM possession.
I wonder how aware they are of the damage to the EU's reputation that they're continually creating by repeatedly bringing this back
I think this theme of the EU, this lack of taboo against continually bringing unwanted laws until they pass by fatigue, it may well be the death of the institution as a whole. every time they try, every time people hear about it, more and more think worse of the EU, and unlike most western governments, the existence and function of the EU is actually severely vulnerable to what people think of it. no other major government takes as much reputational damage from laws that don't even pass, and the existence of no other major government is as vulnerable to reputational damage as the EU is right now. all it takes is another 1 or 2 major exits and the whole thing will slowly collapse, which is insanely sad
The UK government laundering unpopular regulations through the EU and then blaming the EU for them even when the UK had proposed and often championed then was definitely a factor in Brexit passing.
Somewhat relevantly, the UK already has their own version of this legislation in the Online Safety Act which lead to a bunch of small-medium UK community sites closing and the likes of Imgur, pixiv and 4chan blocking the UK.
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You describe the EU as an undemocratic institution that brings about unwanted laws by fatigue, I understand that perspective.
You also say that the collapse of the EU would be insanely sad. I also understand that perspective.
What I don't understand is how somebody could have both of these points of view at once, in the same comment no less.
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Lobbying.
EU delegates and council members have to report their meetings with lobbyists.
Palantir and Thorn lobbyists (just the most famous ones, but you can add another few dozens security and data companies) are recorded meeting many times with countless of them, including Ursula von der Leyen.
It's really as simple as that, sales pitches convincing them of all the benefits of having more intelligence "to catch criminals (wink)".
After reflecting on this a bit earlier this year, I came to the same conclusion; Palantir and maybe other like minded lobbying clueless politicians. It is a considerable weakness in the way laws are formed and voted on.
> Palantir and Thorn lobbyists
So, US interests? Which means the NSA?
No need to look that far.
Palantir sells software for analyzing data, like Excel but on a large scale. If "Chat Control" passes, they will need software to analyze the data they collect, which is exactly what Palantir sells. It is just business.
I don't know about Thorn but it looks like the same: they sell software that may be of use for implementing "Chat Control".
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I don't want to fall in a conspiracy but to me it seems there's an entire sector interested into relaxing E2E cryptography and data access.
Even if the NSA was not involved the same data and security companies would have the same incentives imho.
The council of the EU operates on a rotating chair model (which gets called Presidency, sometimes Presidency of the EU)
It's currently held by Denmark so it's the Danish delegation that's mostly doing the brokering etc for this semester
I guess it never hurts to try and find alternate ways of placating the US in order to make them get over their Greenland obession.
twisting into pretzels to try to find some way to blame this on the US. sorry honey this is all y’all
I don't care about Greenland one way or another, but I find it funny that the Europeans are so visibly upset about this when the Danish took the territory without permission themselves and are now crying that an even bigger thief might want to come take it from them.
This is 1814 we're talking about, right? That's only a decade after Louisiana Purchase just for reference and before the Mexican-American war. I guess we might as well give all that back to the Mexicans? You can play this game to the end of time. There's a reason for statute of limitations in law.
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Meanwhile they turn a blind eye to Turkey taking Cyprus because they need Turkey on side for the migration crisis and Ukraine.
Everyone operates on self-interest but not everyone is smug about it.
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Time is a factor. Taking land is what was done in the past. US wanting to do it now is as if Mexico decided to revive slavery and threatend to capture Afroamericans in USA. It's a touchy subject and I think most of US wouldn't be exactly on board with this idea.
Especially since putin shows us exactly what happens if you try.
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The US pressured the UK to withdrawn encryption backdoors.
Hard to believe any of them actually take that seriously. What a bunch of babies
I was told the proposal the Danes carried forward actually had its roots from Sweden.
Every Chat Control proposal has its roots in Sweden. It originated with Ylva Johansson.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_to_Prevent_and_Comb...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ylva_Johansson
this is an assuaging read. the German government decided it was illegal. reading this featured article, they don't appear to have changed their minds, plus another couple of countries, too. so what are we worried about?
My conspiracy theory is because they’d probably give a lot of contracts to Palantir (see the UK giving NHS to Palantir on a silver platter), and the US basically threatening to annex Greenland recently