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Comment by pjdesno

3 hours ago

> "Trellis coded modulation got this rate up to 50 kilobaud by the 1990s"

Not quite, and an interesting story that fits these engineering maxims better than you might think.

An analog channel with the bandwidth and SNR characteristics of a landline phone line has (IIRC) a Shannon capacity of 30-something kbit/s, which was closely approached with V.34, which used trellis coded modulation plus basically every other coding and equalization mechanism they knew of at the time to get to 33.6kb/s on a good day.

But... by the 80s or so the phone system was only analog for the "last mile" to the home - the rest of the system was digital, sending 8-bit samples (using logarithmic mu-law encoding) at a sampling rate of 8000 samples/s, and if you had a bunch of phone lines coming into a facility you could get those lines delivered over a digital T1 link.

Eventually someone realized that if your ISP-side modem directly outputs digital audio, the downstream channel capacity is significantly higher - in theory the limit is probably 64000 bit/s, i.e. the bit rate of the digital link, although V.90 could only achieve about 56000 b/s in theory, and more like 53kb/s in practice. (in particular, the FCC limited the total signal power, which means not all 64000 combinations of bits in a second of audio would be allowable)

I worked with modem modulation folks when I was a co-op student in the mid-80s. They had spent their lives thinking about the world in terms of analog channels, and it took some serious out-of-the-box thinking on someone's part to realize that the channel was no longer analog, and that you could take advantage of that.

A few years later those same folks all ended up working on cable modems, and it was back to the purely analog world again.

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pjdesno

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computator  1 hour ago

> if your ISP-side modem directly outputs digital audio, the downstream channel capacity is significantly higher

But why is it higher? It's still an analog channel (the last mile from the ISP to your house), right? Doesn't it get filtered? So isn't it still subject to the Shannon-Nyquist limit?

Here's an ASCII drawing of which parts are digital vs analog as I understood your explanation:

  Rest of world<--- digital--->Telco<---digital--->ISPmodem<---analog--->HomeModem

Suppose you're saying that the link between the ISPmodem and the HomeModem is a bare unfiltered copper wire. In that case, I have a different question: Couldn't you send data at megabits per seconds over a mile long copper wire without using modems at all (using just UARTs?).

I hope you can clear up my confusion.

  • db48x  1 hour ago

    No, it’s more like HomeModem ←A→ Exchange1 ←D→ Exchange2 ←A→ ISPModem. The digital parts were all inside the telco’s networks that connect the exchanges to each other.

    > Couldn't you send data at megabits per seconds over a mile long copper wire without using modems at all (using just UARTs?).

    No. The exchange is sampling the analog signal coming in over your phone line at 8kHz and 8 bits per sample. They just designed modems that sent digital data over that analog link, in a way that would line up exactly with the way the exchange will sample it.