Comment by 9dev
14 days ago
But instead, you need this other thing, which requires elaborate infrastructure and new standards and regulations
14 days ago
But instead, you need this other thing, which requires elaborate infrastructure and new standards and regulations
The other thing OP presents is very different from any eID scheme in terms of anonymity. You'd show an ID to a human at the counter and even if the seller stores your info somehow, it can't be linked to the token they sold to you. The required infrastructure is minimal and relatively simplistic. The only drawback is that being anonymous means it's easy to resell tokens.
An eID system links your real life identity to any use of the eID online. Anyone who thinks there's a math or technology that fixes this misses the fact that it's the trust in the humans (companies, institutions, governments) who operate these systems is misplaced. Math and technology are implemented by people so there are many opportunities to abuse these systems. And once in place I guarantee, without any shadow of doubt that sooner or later, fast or slow, it will be expanded to any online action.
I will take anonymity and the small minority of kids who will find a loophole to access some adult-only stuff over the inevitable overreach and abuse against the large majority of people whose every online move will be traced and logged.
> The only drawback is that being anonymous means it's easy to resell tokens.
That’s a pretty major flaw. These tokens will be sold with markup on black markets, rendering the whole system unfit for its intended purpose.
Additionally, in line of drawbacks, buying porn scratch cards will be stigmatised, because everyone will (think they) know what you’ll use them for. Are you comfortable doing it in front of your teenage child, neighbor, crush, grandma, or spouse?
> Math and technology are implemented by people so there are many opportunities to abuse these systems.
And yet we have functioning asymmetric cryptography systems that enable secure encryption for billions of people, despite malevolent actors having a clear incentive to subvert that, much more so than age verification tokens.
> […] the inevitable overreach and abuse against the large majority of people whose every online move will be traced and logged.
This is happening right now already, in a scale hardly imaginable.
> These tokens will be sold with markup on black markets,
Black markets catering to minors aren't very large or profitable. No adult needs to buy from this black market. How big is the black market for beer for teenagers? Yes, some reselling will happen, just as minors sometimes get alcohol or tobacco from older friends and siblings. Prosecute anyone involved. It doesn't have to be perfect. It just has to be good enough without sacrificing privacy.
> buying porn scratch cards will be stigmatised
There was once a time, in living memory, when people had Playboy and Hustler mailed to their houses. You're overthinking it. And also why would the seller assume it's for adult content instead of social media?
> Are you comfortable doing it in front of your teenage child, neighbor, crush, grandma, or spouse?
So don't do it in front of them? You're allowed to go to stores alone.
And who is the biggest winner?
Triceratops Age Verification services, provided a state-sanctioned monopoly on issuing Porn Licenses. Awful, really.
It doesn't have to be 1 company. Ideally it would be many companies competing on price, promotions, and other marketing.
Ok, so grifting for you and your friends?
It’s a really bad idea. It’s not a problem that needs to be solved by building a market for porn licenses.
3 replies →
> elaborate infrastructure
Gift cards are "elaborate infrastructure"? C'mon be serious please.
The government API, the legislation around it all, the legal framework for the gift card issuers, the public education necessary, and on and on — there’s lots of complexity hidden in those "gift cards".
> The government API
There's no government API.