Comment by russdill
16 hours ago
If you buy a consumer product labeled "military grade" you are buying snake oil. And not just snake oil, incredibly over priced snake oil.
16 hours ago
If you buy a consumer product labeled "military grade" you are buying snake oil. And not just snake oil, incredibly over priced snake oil.
There are some ratings, like semiconductor temperature ratings, with labels that include "military", (e.g. manufacturers may name their products, from the narrowest to widest operating temperatures, with something like: commercial, industrial, automotive, military) and "military" would indicate a better product.
On the other hand, when a product is designed and manufactured to sell to a military, it's going to be expensive, and that extra cost isn't going to quality or capability, it's going to compliance. You're more than likely paying extra to get something using some old and outdated technology, that includes paperwork to prove that it's only built using the approved old and outdated technology.
Military-grade just means it has a spec, now, I will admit having a spec is nice, very nice. but in general it says little about the actual quality of the item. And if the spec can't be found or there is no spec. Probably best to stay away, in those cases they are not even selling you the snake oil but the sound of it sloshing in the bottle.
There is no legal requirement for it to refer to MIL-SPEC. More often than not it is just pure marketing without any actual spec tied to it
Yeah if you see something labelling itself "MIL-SPEC", that's grade A snake oil bullshit.
That said military spec stuff is actually generally a good sign that something is of higher quality than random off the shelf garbage but only if you know there's a specific spec you want it to work with. And most of the time you aren't even necessarily looking for a MIL-STD (standard) but rather a MIL-PRF (performance rating/spec).
So like if something is "MIL-SPEC" run. But if you see say a spool of fiber that is "MIL-STD-1678 compliant" and more importantly "MIL-PRF-49291 compliant" and "MIL-PRF-85054 compliant", that's probably a really good sign that it'll do its job. The former PRF documenting perf requirements for the fiber itself and the latter PRF the cabling/sheath's corrosion and deterioration resistance.
It's the military so odds are it'll probably cost extra for that and it'll still kinda suck but it'll suck in exactly the way they promised.
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Military grade afaict just implies the military ‘could’ use it, by that definition almost any company sells military grade products or services, except companies who explicitly would not sell to the military.
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FS will literally sell you heavy-duty Armored (e.g. thicker/stronger sheath) cable and the packet it comes in will be labelled "military grade". That's literally your scenario.
Is one supposed to send it back for a refund and order the much thinner, less-durable cable? Or is perhaps the landscape not as black-and-white as your "this is automatically snake-oil"?
Exactly. It's a very successful marketing play on MIL-SPEC:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Military_Standar...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_grade
Basically same with any company with "Patriot" or "Veteran" in the name.
It's just a weak pander to people's weak egos. Freedumb, if you will.
I’m waiting for “Titanium Sourdough” optical fibres myself.
Well those materials are verifiable at least.
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Tactical everything!
America is a country which thinks buying cheap tat from China with American Flags on is patriotic
I don’t disagree but it’s not hard to understand why people think “military grade” means it’s better. “Military grade” communicates tough/durable/stress tested to a lot of people. Veteran/patriot isn’t an indicator of build quality, even if it is also pandering to a certain sensibility.
Not really if it is owned by Veterans. There are many veteran owned businesses and I see nothing wrong with it.
There are even military grade phone cases, whatever that means.
What if it's Military Grade Snake Oil?
Someone should legit retry actually selling oil made of snakes as a miracle solution to some modern problem.
Military grade: mass produced by the lowest bidder
I only use handmade artisanal networking equipment.
> Military grade: mass produced by the lowest bidder
This
In the military, military grade is a synonym for crap
Well, not mass produced enough.
Common mass produced products manufacturers have incentives to not mess-up too badly: recalls or warranties on such scales are a nightmare.
With military contracts, its a paid maintenance opportunity.
There are plenty of things where mil spec is extremely strict and high quality. They wont be sold to consumers as they are priced accordingly
A company can not sell a product to consumers cheaper than it can sell to the federal government, and the federal government contract normally comes first. A lot of the stuff you can buy (minus restricted items), it'll just cost you.
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"Military-grade" has a very specific meaning: it's at least 10x overpriced and painted black.
I personally look for the 1,000x overpriced space marine spec so I can get it in white.
Why black? Shouldn’t it be camouflage?
No, that would be “tactical.”
Drop it in some mud
> incredibly over priced snake oil.
Military grade snake oil?
When I see "military grade" I assume overpriced $30,000 hammer
But shitload of vendors won't bother and just sell you a "military grade" or, even in non-english speaking countriess, say a "MIL-SPEC Daniel Defense AR-15". They won't list every spec in detail. And they make good AR-15s (but not cheap).
Anyone who thinks the triggers listed as MIL-SPEC from, say, Geissele here:
https://geissele.com/triggers.html
aren't totally fine is out of his mind. They're amazing triggers, widely used and loved.
And they don't say which specs its passing (at least not on the main page): it's just MIL-SPEC.
As a sidenote my very best laptop passes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIL-STD-810 but most people will just say it's "military grade" or "MIL-SPEC".
Guess what? Its screen never broke overnight like the one of my MacBook M1 Air did (the infamous "bendgate").
I can bend my LG Gram's screen and it's keeps working fine. I can let it drop. Friend who sold it to me stepped on it when he woke up once.
There's a very big difference between saying: "There are shady vendors" and saying "Military specs do not exists and it's impossible for consumers to buy items passing military specifications".
Yes, there are dishonest vendors.
Yes, military specs do exist.
And, yes, it's possible for consumers to buy products passing (and even surpassing) actual military specs.
If you buy a commercial product labelled "military grade", you are also buying snake oil.
"Military grade" is generally shit. It's built down to a price, manufactured the cheapest possible way, so they can get the lowest possible tender submitted. Bonus prize if the manufacturer is owned by either someone already in government, or with close ties to someone in government.
The only "military grade" devices I own are some woefully unsuccessful radios, which failed in the market because they were actually good - easy to use, reliable, and easy to repair - which made them about 5% more expensive than the cheapest option which was made by a company part-owned by the government and part-owned by someone who donates heavily to the Conservatives.