Comment by drcongo
4 days ago
Chinese EVs are already way ahead of most western EVs - really, you need to see some of the cars the likes of Zeekr, Lynk & Co, Denza and Xpeng are releasing.
4 days ago
Chinese EVs are already way ahead of most western EVs - really, you need to see some of the cars the likes of Zeekr, Lynk & Co, Denza and Xpeng are releasing.
Having lived/worked in China for 6 years and knowing how most companies there operate and the way they cut corners so things look shiny on the outside but are crappy on the inside, I have very little confidence in any Chinese brand, especially not any of the newer brands. I would not buy a Chinese EV even at a lower price point.
There are a couple of exceptions to the above -- DJI and Anker are two companies I do trust -- but those are companies who have had a very strong focus on Western markets for years now, which forces them into a whole different level of QA. And they make much simpler products than EVs. Xiaomi _could_ potentially a trusted EV brand, they've been around a long time, tried to be the "Apple of China" and certainly came closer than other brands, but while I'd buy a phone from them I wouldn't buy a car from them.
So I lived and worked in China for 9+ years, I worked in a design studio for Microsoft and worked with many designers who, after the 2008-9 layoffs, went to help found Xiaomi.
Chinese brands 20 years ago (my first stint living in China was in 2002) were like Japanese brands 40-50 years ago. And now they are where Japanese brands were 20-30 years ago. Some of them are becoming serious competitors: robo-vacs, 3D printers, drones, heatpumps, cars...many of those categories they are basically the only players ATM.
Cars are an important point: a $10k BYD is basically a $10k car and nice enough for what you paid for. The higher end options seem ok as well, and are on par with what you would get in the US. You buy an EV for $60k in China, you'll get a bit less than what you get in the US due to higher luxury taxes, but not that much less (definitely not like it used to be where a nice car would cost $100k+).
Could you explain some specific ways in which they are ahead?
In the case of the Xiaomi SU7[1]: you name it. Pretty much every conceivable way. Performance, comfort, electronics, styling, build quality. Xiaomi is on par with Apple for electronics and they actually followed through on making the car Apple wishes they made. Sells for around 40k, so on par with a Model 3, but absolutely embarrasses anything Tesla makes.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdSusCDZcDg
Their world leading battery tech is much cheaper and last longer, as they bet on the right tech compared to basically every western car company. Their cars overall are much cheaper for equivalent or better quality. Their car companies are desperate to stand out given there are over 100 of them so produce wide ranges of extra features and designs.
But the battery is commodity technology, not a moat. There's not much stopping every other manufacturer from adopting the same thing.
And of course they are cheaper, they are selling in a market with much lower price capacity. They would not be nearly so cheap if they sold in the market like the US, so it is not sensible to compare prices as if they would.
For starters they can sell EVs at a profit, a feat which I believe only Tesla has managed among the US manufacturers.
Sure, but that's mostly an R&D vs time thing. All manufacturers go through a period of time where they are losing huge money as they build out the production capacity and develop their tech. Tesla went years without making money, as did BYD. The incumbents will get there eventually.
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