Comment by dragontamer
3 days ago
Sounds like ICE's official word right now is that the guy had a gun.
But the video clearly indicates that they all tackled him to the ground and were wrestling him maybe 4 vs 1, before they all shot him together. I'm not quite sure how a gun can have come out of this. Maybe the guy while struggling on the ground happened to reach in the direction of someone's gun while getting curbstomped, I dunno.
What I'm most worried about is that Pam Bondi / Department of Justice refuses to investigate these or properly prosecute these cases. IE: The Renee Good case has a ton of FBI agents resigning because they've been told to focus on Good's "misbehavior" rather than the ICE Agent's aggression.
It will be up to the Minnesota police and justice system to investigate. We cannot expect anything from the DoJ/FBI here. As such, the prosecution case will be gimped, and I fear we will have nothing resembling justice in this case (or Renee Good's case either).
> At a news conference, Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O’Hara said the man who was shot was a 37-year-old white man with no serious criminal history and a record that showed some parking tickets. Law enforcement sources said Saturday their records show Pretti had no serious criminal history.
> O'Hara said the man was a “lawful gun owner” with a permit. Records show that Pretti attended the University of Minnesota. State records show Pretti was issued a nursing license in 2021, and it remains active through March 2026.
Minnesota permit-to-carry requirements: https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/public-services-bca/firearm...
> Q: Do I have to disclose to a peace officer that I am a permit holder and carrying a firearm?
> A: Yes, upon request of a peace officer, a permit holder must disclose to the officer whether or not the permit holder is currently carrying a firearm.
So a U.S. citizen who is a legal, permitted gun owner with no outstanding criminal charges, legally carrying in public, who complies with the law and informs a DHS officer that they are legally carrying, is effectively subject to summary execution without due process. (The penalty for permitted carrying without possessing the physical permit card is $25 for a first offense and forfeiture of the weapon; it would've been his first offense per Minneapolis police.)
If ever there was a 2A violation, it's a federal officer shooting and killing a legal gun owner solely for possessing a gun in their presence.
Possessing a fire arm and having an encounter with law enforcement in the united states has long been a death sentence. You can find a multitude of videos online of cops doing stuff like getting the wrong address and beating on someones door and when that person opens the door with a gun in their hand and then the cops open fire, happens all the time.
But this person did not even have a gun in his hand. He had a gun on him, concealed. In fact, the video shows another ICE agent walking up to him and digging it out and taking it away. The execution happened after all of that.
The most likely situation is that he actually voluntarily told them that he has a firearm because he is a lawful gun owner with a concealed carry permit. Most gun owners know that this is the best way to interact with law-enforcement, for example, when you get pulled over. But we will not know because these agents do not wear body cams on purpose.
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I seem to recall the Bundys having no trouble pointing guns directly at law enforcement. They became cause celebres for the right.
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The bargain with law enforcement has always been that ostensibly if you comply, they will take you in peacefully. For obvious reasons, this is highly advantageous to both parties.
It seems like a foolish choice for them to reneg on this. They are essentially signaling that you are a trapped rat with no way out.
It is not foolish if you consider they are looking for their Reichstag fire.
> They are essentially signaling that you are a trapped rat with no way out.
It makes sense if making you feel like a trapped rat is the goal.
That’s true if you want to keep the peace. The way to read their actions is that they’re trying to incite violence.
If Trump can incite violence then he can invoke the insurrection act, or perhaps declare some form of martial law to seize more power. Perhaps even parlay this into cancelling the midterm elections.
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> peace officer
What’s it called when you name something the complete opposite of what it is?
Not an oxymoron, because that’s about the concepts in the words.
the link returns 404 now
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I don't think the phrasing of "confront law enforcement" is right here, in a period of about 20 seconds he went from helping a woman who had been pushed, to maced in the face, to dead. This is not confrontation, you can literally see him clutching the woman he had previously been helping up in a panic after they were sprayed with chemicals.
But setting all of that aside (which is a big aside), even if he was confronting them with his camera while armed, the whole bullshit shtick of the second amendment is that being armed should not be a crime much less a death sentence. He did not brandish his weapon or threaten law enforcement in any of the half dozen videos that have been released so far. To be even more clear as a citizen you are allegedly supposed to be protected from summary execution/judgement with or without the possession of a firearm, in many legal circles the possession of a firearm grants you more protections under the law not less.
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That's a really good question for all those ICE and DHS agents.
I suspect a partial answer might be that many are not in their right minds, are under trained, and over motivated by bonus payments and past divorces.
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Wow, that's some deep passive-aggressive victim blaming right there.
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> So a U.S. citizen who is a legal, permitted gun owner with no outstanding criminal charges, legally carrying in public, who complies with the law and informs a DHS officer that they are legally carrying, is effectively subject to summary execution without due process.... a federal officer shooting and killing a legal gun owner solely for possessing a gun in their presence.
This completely misrepresents what happened.
Another source (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/man-tackled-by-ice-in-chao...) gives another claim from the same police chief:
> "The officers attempted to disarm the suspect but the armed suspect violently resisted. More details on the armed struggle are forthcoming."
And then, from the DHS:
> ...when a federal agent feared for his life, "an agent fired defensive shots." ... Border Patrol Cmdr. Greg Bovino said that the officer involved in the shooting "has extensive training," and that "the situation is evolving." Bovino added that the incident would be investigated.
(TFA includes the claim of self-defense.)
"Summary execution" and "without due process" is emotionally manipulative phrasing. It falsely implies that LEO use of lethal force is about punishment. It is not about punishment. It is about responding to perceived threat.
All this stuff about permit cards, the victim's lack of criminal history, etc. is irrelevant. It is not connected to the motivation for the shooting. There is nothing to establish that the shooting was "solely for" that possession, and LEO denies that claim. There is no plausible universe in which the officer says "please show me the permit for that weapon", Pretti says "I don't have it", and the officer shoots. But that's the narrative you appear to be trying to push.
> Another source (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/man-tackled-by-ice-in-chao...) gives another claim from the same police chief:
>> "The officers attempted to disarm the suspect but the armed suspect violently resisted. More details on the armed struggle are forthcoming."
You've misread your link. The "violently resisted" quote is from a tweet by DHS, not local police: https://xcancel.com/DHSgov/status/2015115351797780500
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I suspect it won't matter to you, but there's clear footage now of officers having removed the gun from the suspect long before he was shot. He was pinned and prone when he was executed. Claiming this was "defensive" is just a lie.
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> "The officers attempted to disarm the suspect but the armed suspect violently resisted. More details on the armed struggle are forthcoming."
This has already been proven to be a lie thanks to the five different videos of the incident in question. They shot him after removing his legal weapon for concealed carry that he was permitted to have on his person.
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"It is not about punishment."
I’m not sure how you can possibly make that assertion. They disarmed him and then they shot him.
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> "Summary execution" and "without due process" is emotionally manipulative phrasing.
It's exactly what this was, though. He was disarmed before being shoved to the ground and beaten with a gas grenade. There is another video which shows that his hands are on the ground or in front of his face, the entire time he's down, long before he's shot.
Watch the fucking videos.
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DHS has yet to release a factually accurate statement about any ICE-involved violence, you really think this time they're telling the truth?
You know you can watch the videos yourself
Honestly, man, there is no other answer to this than this: you are a nazi sympathizer.
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Someone captured the beginning of the shooting victim’s interaction with ICE. It certainly doesn’t look as though the person is aggressive or brandishing a weapon.
The DHS public statement that the victim was going to “do maximize damage and massacre law enforcement” is outrageous…
https://x.com/David_J_Bier/status/2015125221938770324
ICE has regularly attacked protesters and bystanders who are simply recording, walking away and so on.
Even people just driving through their neighborhood have been dragged out of their vehicles and apprehended. Citizen or otherwise doesn’t seem to matter.
They aren’t professionals and operate with neither the training, nor the will to obey the law.
Much of the time they seem to believe trying to bait folks into an encounter
https://www.reddit.com/r/ICE_Raids/comments/1q7u4kz/ice_agen...
https://www.reddit.com/r/minnesota/comments/1q7y43s/cbp_poin...
In my area all the non white folks don’t come to the bus stop anymore to pickup their kids. Their kids are instructed to race home after school. The schools now have lockdown protocols for ICE. Family businesses opened for decades closed because employees are afraid to come to work.
> They aren’t professionals and operate with neither the training, nor the will to obey the law.
Many of them are experienced and trained. The man who shot Renee Good served in Iraq, worked for Border Patrol for two decades and was literally a firearms instructor[1].
This is just what cops, reactionaries and psychopaths will do when they know that they have carte blanche to do anything they want, including murder.
No amount of "training" will fix this. It isn't an accident, it isn't incompetence, it is deliberate and wanton.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Ren%C3%A9e_Good#Jon...
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> Much of the time they seem to be trying to bait folks into an encounter
Those are kids playing to be cops. If the PS5 was affordable to people with such a low level of education they'd be playing CoD at home.
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>>The schools now have lockdown protocols for ICE<<
if the day ever came for ICE to breach a locked down school, and extract minors, that could be a tipping point.
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> ICE has regularly attacked protesters and bystanders who are simply recording, walking away and so on.
> Even people just driving through their neighborhood have been dragged out of their vehicles and apprehended. Citizen or otherwise doesn’t seem to matter.
I have seen many claims of this sort, but every single time there's been video available of the incident, it's become clear to me that nothing of the sort is going on. The people "being dragged out of vehicles" have been refusing lawful orders and then being arrested for it. The people "simply recording" are physically interfering with ICE going where they need to go to do what they're there to do. "Walking away" doesn't remotely describe anything I've seen.
As for the race issue, the ICE officers I've seen have been considerably more racially diverse than the protesters.
But no, being a citizen does not, in fact, matter if you are breaking federal law in the presence of a federal agent, and that law includes obstruction of federal justice. All of this is extremely clear in law. Please have a look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NosECXHMGFU.
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This comment, like many others I've made on the topic, has been completely illegitimately flagged. I'm getting rather tired of that. There's nothing objectionable or counter to guidelines in the above, and all of it reflects my true thoughts based on my actual experience of the discourse, the evidence available to me, the legal code I've researched, etc.
It perhaps just doesn't agree with your point of view.
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Pam Bondi's Department of Justice will be worse. They're the ones who are in charge of investigating this. I expect the FBI under her to support ICE and defend them with all their might.
The checks and balances at the federal level are all captured. Support Minnesota in this troubling time.
No one will be held to account as long as Trump or his collaborators are in power.
If anyone views the current situation as a problem, there is no viable solution that doesn’t involve removing MAGA from power.
The very first thing Trump administration did after assuming office was fire almost all the Inspectors General. Seems obvious, foreboding and foreshadowing, it was to sweep away any independent oversight and accountability.
Oh boy the hand waving away at the time. Now the other shoe is dropping.
Yeah but you shoulda seen the look on his face after the government killed him and edited the image!
> What I'm most worried about is that Pam Bondi / Department of Justice refuses to investigate these or properly prosecute these cases.
Law enforcement above accountability is a hallmark sign of “too far gone”.
Law enforcement is one thing but when Washington sends war-fighters into a state against the will of the state's leadership, somebody has got to be prepared to take some casualties if there is any resistance.
The greater the force and amount of armament, the worse it can end up becoming.
It wasn't good when it happened in the 19th century either.
War-fighter is a generous description given the preparedness of the agents they’re sending. This is how they’re behaving against disorganized whistle-blowing confrontational citizens, not e.g. an ideologically-motivated separatist militia.
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> What I'm most worried about is that Pam Bondi / Department of Justice refuses to investigate these or properly prosecute these cases.
There’s a lot to be worried here, but I’m surprised that’s what you are more worried about
There is no doubt in my mind that the the current DOJ won’t lift a finger against any of the agents involved
Hmm... well maybe I need to explain my fear better.
Because Pam Bondi/DoJ refuses to prosecute these cases, this will _keep happening_ for the foreseeable future. There's no reason for ICE to stop this behavior.
Its not today's crime that scares me most. Its the easily predicted future where this gets worse by next month.
The converse is the rise of the far-left. We're already seeing Black Panther patrol with long-guns rise up in these times in response to this. I expect more guns and more deadly force, and no one is doing anything to put a stop to it.
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The left is losing faith in strictly peaceful protest. At least some of them (ie: the Black Panthers forming patrol militia).
The right refuses to prosecute murders. This is the worse problem.
Where does this lead? Is it too late to stop? Its easily stopped if Pam Bondi simply did an investigation into the use of deadly force. That's the saddest part of all of this.
The [white] Heritage Foundation has many binders on how to mitigate/quash peaceful protests.
We don't live in the time of Ghandi anymore.
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the DOJ won't and that's why it happened again only a few days after Renee Good, and will continue to happen.
It's not just that the DOJ won't investigate. It's actively preventing the state from investigating either.
if this continues, it's going to explode, and I think that's part of the plan, to provide cover for invoking the Insurrection Act and imposing martial law
It's always been strange to me that Americans are allowed to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights...until they get killed by police. Then they should've known not to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights.
Everything makes much more sense when you realize that the conservative project is not about universal application of rights. It is a system of hierarchies. They have rights. We do not. They can carry firearms. We are violent maniacs trying to massacre cops (according to Bovino) and deserve what's coming.
The 2nd amendment was more about suppressing slave revolts than liberating slaves.
Yeah, it's almost like people walking around with guns is a bad idea.
Yeah, somebody should do something about that. Masked men with guns and unlimited immunity aren't good to have around in your community.
Oh, wait, you meant the victim.
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>"Yeah, it's almost like people walking around with guns is a bad idea."
When those people are ICE it definitely is. I think those motherfuckers should be wearing straightjackets
Same goes for law enforcement, but it's a Constitutional right that the right does not want to amend.
The group of Americans who are the loudest at cheering for the 2nd Amendment rights are cheering for ICE these days. To them, "the security of a free State" means that it has a caste system with the "good guys" at the top, and when ICE goons execute Minnesotans, they see brave armed citizens fighting back against the tyranny of wokeness.
The truth of this hurts my soul
What I've observed is that Americans like to put themselves higher than other cultures due to their second amendment rights (and first, but that's neither here nor there), but when push comes to shove there's actually no real positive outcomes that come from having a country with it's citizens armed to the extent that Americans are.
And we've seen what allowing people to promote hate speech with no restraint does to a nation.
When it's over, and it will be, Americans need to start from scratch, iterate and write a new constitution, create new institutions and build a new system.
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>> Sounds like ICE's official word right now is that the guy had a gun.
Look at the gray agent taking the victim weapon, that had just been pepper sprayed. He was disarmed before being killed.
"Footage of the grey coat officer retrieving the gun" - https://www.reddit.com/r/law/comments/1qlvpbr/footage_of_the...
https://www.reddit.com/r/law/comments/1qm2vi0/heres_your_pro...
What's important to understand is you can do everything lawful, and they will still lie about you and kill you.
If the Right does end up defending this, I don't see how they are compatible with the USA that I was taught to believe in my whole life.
Ironically, all the major gun rights orgs have registered disapproval.
The NRA didn't.
https://x.com/NRA/status/2015224606680826205
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That ship has sailed so long ago it's beyond the horizon at this point. Of course the right is going to defend this. We know exactly how this will play out. They will respond just like they have to every other assault and murder committed by ICE in the past year.
The top people in govt all the way down will completely lie about the victim and situation, despite plenty of video evidence that shows them as liars. Absolutely nothing will happen to these scumbag murderers, and another murder just like this will happen again soon.
Many people will be horrified but conservatives will continue cheering this on. This is the country we live in now.
Isn't it obvious? You were taught a lie.
All the blathering about "freedom", "democracy", and "constitutional rights" is just propaganda you've been spoon-fed since you were a child. The USA has spent the last 80 years riding the wave of contributing to the victory in WWII and therefore being the "Good Guys", and most of the Western world happily played along as their political goals aligned with it.
Meanwhile the USA hasn't addressed its deeply-rooted internal issues which have been festering for well over a century, and the results are now obvious to everyone. It only took Trump a year to make the US an international laughing stock, start a bunch of wars, get rid of the free press, and begin rounding up people he doesn't like.
If the USA you were taught to believe in truly existed, the current situation would not have been possible.
Nah. I was taught by the actions of neighbors. I was taught by my school becoming less segregated in California and becoming majority latino and no one caring. I was taught by my grandfather, what he did in his life, and how he lived.
I was 'taught' through experiencing something good becoming more good. Get out of here with your doomerism toxicity. You talk like the non-political Russians talk about their country. The USA is not irredeemable.
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Here’s a post analyzing each part of the video and showing the evidence:
https://xcancel.com/adamscochran/status/2015119306086900170
They had him pinned on the ground, then someone takes a gun away from him, and AFTER THAT they put him on his knees and executed him.
Additionally, there are many other videos of the agents, taking phones away from the nearby witnesses who recorded all of this.
But the most disturbing thing is that the claims made by DHS, Trump, and Noem about what happened were completely made up. They are simply inventing a story and getting it out there as quickly as possible to refute any other competing story. It does not matter to them that this is a lie. The idea is to muddy the waters.
It’s like that old Bill Hicks routine, except the US is now doing it to itself instead of (only) other countries.
“You all saw him, he had a gun”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdf8UvkjUbc
It won’t be up to the Minnesota police to investigate. A Minnesota judge gave them a warrant and feds still denied them access.
Well it looks like it's time to say bye-bye to the 2nd amendment right to keep and bear arms in the US, right? NRA and all that notwithstanding it seems if you're bearing arms you will be shot. Interesting times.
It's hard to argue the guy was even bearing arms. He just kneeled and stoically accepted his execution. And then the people surrounding him asked the feds to please not do that.
The Whiskey Rebellion, was bearing arms.
Even if they guy had a gun, it's left to see what actually transpired here. Whether the guy owned the gun, had firearm permit and even if he had a public and/or concealed gun permit.
That's already been revealed by Minnesota Police (thank goodness we at least have some degree of independent investigations going on right now).
1. Only had parking tickets on his criminal record. No other criminal activity.
2. Owned a gun with firearms permit.
3. 36 Years Old, male. EDIT: I misremembered. Its apparently 37 year old male.
Minnesota Police only have jurisdiction inside of Minnesota however. So those four+ ICE shooters just need to leave the state and they're safe. The FBI is required to pursue across state lines.
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From a purely theoretical standpoint, what should the family victims do then, in a country where rule of law is not being applied anymore? If these deaths will go unpunished - and Alex Pretti's is already well documented and clear EXECUTION - what are the direct consequence as a society with a 2nd amendment?
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Watch the video from all angles. There is no way to defend your position if you watch the actual footage of what happened.
If the Right does end up defending this, I don't see how they are compatible with the USA that I was taught to believe in my whole life.
Don't bother interacting with the other guy. He's a known troll that comes to every discussion about ICE and tries to put the blame on the victim, and then rants about Obama for some reason.
This guy is in full support of the recent ICE murders. Moderation still hasn't banned the guy, of course.
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You have the right to carry. Period end. Full stop. Exercising your constitutional right is not "looking for trouble."
If someone is going in to a situation where they know there are armed riot police, armed federal agents, armed and agitated protestors, and several people have already been unalived, I would call them nothing but "suicidal" to carry their own weapon into that situation. Suicidal. Even when concealed and unused. Suicidal.
Of course they would be suicidal to go into that situation unarmed, as well. But carrying a weapon would be double-plus-ungood and guaranteed to make them a target for unaliving, sticking out from amongst the crowd bearing rocks and sticks or even Molotov cocktails.
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> The video clearly shows him resisting arrest and reaching for something.
The video clearly shows the grey-masked (EDIT: Grey-hat, green mask) ICE Agent taking the gun and running away with it before everyone else shoots him.
Also, I'm inclined to believe the "arrest" was an illegal arrest to begin with. I had a big post about how police procedure and due process is supposed to work but I know no one gives a crap about due process anymore, so forget it.
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>"The video clearly shows him resisting arrest and reaching for something."
Tell me the EXACT time in the video you see this happen.
In the video, there are 4 ICE agents on him and there's not ONE frame where the tackled protester reaches for ANYTHING with his arm/hand. There is, however, a gray-masked ICE agent consistently reaching for what appears to be the protestor's sidearm. And at 0:17, the ICE agent that shoots first reached for his own sidearm, and the ICE agent next to him retrieves what appears to be the protestor's concealed firearm at the same time, and walks away from the pile with it BEFORE shots are even fired. The "threat" - the protestor's right to bear arms - was eliminated before a shot.
There is not a single indication that ICE agents were in danger from anyone besides each other. If he was shot dead for possession, there's your answer for 2A, right there. They're shooting people like dogs in broad daylight for recording police interactions (1A) and possessing a firearm (2A), the tree of liberty needs replenishment.
Keep an eye on grey-mask. (EDIT: More like grey-hat / green mask). He grabbed a gun and ran away from the wrestling match.
You know, long before everyone else executed the guy.
1. The are not going to investigate it. Totally legit right?
2. This regime likes to post deepfakes (even president himself).
Why do you have urge to defend these pedophiles?
They're 100% going to investigate, and intimidate, the Red-coat lady in the background, and the dead guy on the ground so that they have political fodder / some kind of character-assassination excuse for why this was all justified.
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And when you're unlawfully murdered, you have no recourse. They do not care what you tell them, and if you don't resist, you're potentially dead anyway. They have arrested lawful immigrants and citizens, and held them illegally, in some cases for weeks or months.
"Comply and you might get lucky and survive" is not a life safety strategy. I'm unsure where this idea to not resist someone who is very likely to kill you without cause (based on all of the evidence and observations to date) is coming from to be frank.
Why ICE Can Kill With Impunity - https://www.wired.com/story/why-ice-can-kill-with-impunity/ | https://archive.today/gMFRS - January 15th, 2026 ("Over the past decade, US immigration agents have shot and killed more than two dozen people. Not a single agent appears to have faced criminal charges.")
(own firearms, have taken firearm training, still aware never to trust law enforcement)
cops are most deceptive when they are smiling, even if it seems like an aside comment, when that big fake smile is there, they are trying to soft extract something from you [P.E.A.C.E.]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PEACE_method_of_interrogation
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Thank you for this. As far as I understand it, the victim was filming the ICE agent(s). I'm sure you'll agree that counts as resisting arrest and even putting the agent(s) lives at risk.
Hi! I'm curious why you A: Believe this, and B: Think others will agree.
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