← Back to context

Comment by embedding-shape

1 month ago

Yeah, I agree with all of what you wrote, how these are used seems (to me) to be more important than how they're built. If you don't know software engineering, a software engineering agent isn't suddenly gonna make you one, but someone who already knows the craft, can be very effective with one.

Amplifiers, rather than replacements. I think the community at large still thinks LLMs and agents are gonna be "replacing" knowledge, which I think is far from the truth.

7 comments

embedding-shape

Reply
menaerus  1 month ago

I built a moderately complex and very good looking website in ~2 hours with the coding agent. Next step would be to write a backend+storage, and given how well the agent performs in these type of tasks, I assume I will be able to do that in the manner of hours too. I have never ever touched any of the technology involving the web development so, in my case, I can say that I no more need a full-stack dev that in normal circumstances I would definitely do. And the cost is ridiculous - few hours invested + $20 subscription.

I agree however on the point that no prior software engineering skills would make this much more difficult.

  • embedding-shape  1 month ago

    Yeah, I don't doubt you, it's really effective at knocking out "simple" projects, I've had success vibe-coding for days, but eventually unless you have some reins on the architecture/design, it falls down over it's own slop, and it's very noticeable as the agent spends more and more time trying to work in the changes, but it's unable to.

    So the first day or two, each change takes 20-30 minutes. Next day it takes 30-40 minutes per change, next day up to an hour and so on, as the requirements start to interact with each other, together with the ball of spaghetti they've composed and are now trying to change without breaking other parts.

    Contrast that with when you really own the code and design, then you can keep going for weeks, all changes take 20-30 minutes, as at day one. But also means I'm paying attention to what's going on, so no vibe-coding, but pair programming with LLMs, and also requires you to understand both the domain, what you're actually aiming for and the basics of design/architecture.

    • menaerus  1 month ago

      The point was not in simplicity but rather in if AI is replacing some people's jobs. I say that it certainly is, as given by the example, but I also acknowledge that the technology is still not at the point where human engineers are no more required in the loop.

      I built other things too which would not be considered trivial or "simple", or as you say they're architecturally complex, and they involve very domain specific knowledge about programming languages, compilers, ASTs, databases, high-performance optimizations, etc. And for a long time, or shall I say never, have I felt this productive tbh. If I were to setup a company around this, which I believe I could, in pre-LLM era I'd quite literally have to hire 3-5 experienced engineers with sufficient domain expertise to build this together with me - and I mean not in every possible potential but the concrete work I've done in ~2 weeks.

      1 reply →