Comment by rustystump
1 month ago
This is reductive. All kinds of other countries do the same and the purpose is crystal clear. It isnt spying and killing without purpose.
I dont like it either and i didnt like back when it wasnt trendy to not like it. But it isnt pointless. They know what they are about.
The arab states offered a peace plan in 2002 that would include full recognition in exchange of an end of the occupation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Peace_Initiative
At some point it becomes obvious that Israel (under the current government and political climate) doesn't want peace.
In 2000 Israel offered the Palestinians what is essentially the two state solution everyone keeps talking about: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_Camp_David_Summit
At some point it becomes obvious the Palestinians (under their current government and political climate) doesn't want peace.
Wikipedia is not a good source here. There was never a sincere offer accepted by all Palestinians that acknowledged Israel's right to exist. Specifically the sticky point here is the right of return which means that Israel ceases to exist. A peace proposal that includes the destruction of Israel is not one made on good faith. Either way it's not up to the Arab states to make peace here, it's up to the Palestinians.
This proposal?
> Most sources agree, that under Israel's final proposal, the Temple Mount (including Al-Aqsa) would remain under Israeli sovereignty. Israel would also take most of the rest of East Jerusalem, while Palestinians would get some parts too. Israel would annex 8% or 13.5% of the West Bank, and would maintain a military of an additional 6–12% of the West Bank for an unspecified period of time (sometimes called a "long term lease"). According to some sources, Israel would also retain its settlement blocks in the Gaza Strip. The Palestinian state would not be contiguous and the West Bank would be split into 2 or 3 sections. Finally, Israel would control Palestinian airspace.
How is that a sovereign state?
> Specifically the sticky point here is the right of return which means that Israel ceases to exist.
If you see Jewish supremacy as a core element of Israeli statehood, then I guess, yes. There are other concepts though, like a one-state solution, which would solve that.
> Either way it's not up to the Arab states to make peace here, it's up to the Palestinians.
The arab states have leverage though, and in this situation, they tried to use it.
I honestly don't see how Palestinians would be able to make peace if the result is more creeping settlements like in the west bank. What is the outlook here? Where would they live?