Comment by JimDabell
7 hours ago
> You're claiming the terms laid out in the OSD were motivated by hopes of cultivating a community
I didn’t say that. I didn’t bring up the OSD at all. In fact I was explicitly talking about a broader concept than simply license terms from my very first sentence. You were the one that started talking about the OSD.
> It only matters how "open source" is defined, and it's plainly not defined by the presence of any community.
The OSD defines criteria by which software licenses can be considered open source. It doesn’t define the movement as a whole.
>> You're claiming the terms laid out in the OSD were motivated by hopes of cultivating a community.
> I didn’t say that.
If you don't think the statement's true, then what exactly is the meaning of this passage, and what was your purpose in quoting it?
> ... and convince them to create and improve source code by participating in an engaged community.
The thesis of the post is that publishing Open Source software doesn't carry an obligation of maintaining a community. To determine if that's true, what software counts as open source is relevant information. Anything to do with the "movement" isn't.
Your original comment started with the words "Open Source is..." If there's an authoritative document specifying exactly what Open Source is, and it plainly contradicts what you say, then you're wrong.
> Open source is not merely a license choice.
> The OSD defines criteria by which software licenses can be considered open source.
These two statements are exactly contradictory.
> > >> You're claiming the terms laid out in the OSD were motivated by hopes of cultivating a community.
> > I didn’t say that.
> If you don't think the statement's true
I didn’t say that either. Is it really so difficult for you to respond to what I actually say?
I am talking about cultural norms. You are trying to cram what I am saying into something that is purely about license terms. I am repeatedly telling you that I am not talking about license terms and you are repeatedly ignoring that.
> If there's an authoritative document specifying exactly what Open Source is, and it plainly contradicts what you say, then you're wrong.
Again, the OSD defines criteria for licenses, it does not define the movement as a whole. I am talking about the movement, not license terms. If you are unwilling to engage with that point, then don’t. But stop mischaracterising what I am saying.
> > Open source is not merely a license choice.
> > The OSD defines criteria by which software licenses can be considered open source.
> These two statements are exactly contradictory.
They are not. Every time I say “Open Source” you are reading “OSD” but I am repeatedly telling you I am talking about the movement, not the OSD that talks about license terms.
I must just be an idiot, because I don't know how I'm coming off as if I don't understand your main point. Please, let me back up a bit.
I understand you're talking about the movement, not the definition of open source. Yesyesyes I know. I'm saying that the claims made by the OP are true, and there's nothing anyone can possibly say about the bigger movement that can contradict those claims, because the movement, and what it is, and what it's like, are all not relevant.
I thought the question under discussion was "Does publishing open source obligate someone to form or engage with a community?" Since software can be open source without engaging with any practices typical of the movement, nothing to do with the movement matters to answering this question.
I keep harping on the definition, because the definition of open source is vital to answering this. Open Source software does carry obligations with it, just not any obligations that relate to the bigger movement in any way.
That's my point. Everything below is just clearing up details.
>> If you don't think the statement's true... > Is it really so difficult for you to respond to what I actually say?
I know arguments get tedious once one gets a few layers deep, but I just to be clear. I asked you a question, and a question isn't putting words in your mouth because it's not making any statement. Either you agree with the statement, in which case I think it makes it harder to argue against my bigger point, or you don't agree, and I tried to give you the opportunity to elaborate.
>>>> You're claiming the terms laid out in the OSD were motivated by hopes of cultivating a community.
And the reason I asked it is because I genuinely thought this was the point you were making by quoting that passage. Like I said, I'm probably just stupid, but what point exactly were you making by bringing it up?
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