Comment by jeffbee
4 days ago
There's a lot of memes about how dumb it is to have all of the ICE moving parts, but they're just memes. We know how to make engines and they are cheap to mass produce. The complexity argument is aesthetic.
4 days ago
There's a lot of memes about how dumb it is to have all of the ICE moving parts, but they're just memes. We know how to make engines and they are cheap to mass produce. The complexity argument is aesthetic.
I don't know much about cars, but I have to assume that fewer moving parts means less wear and repairs.
That's a fair assumption that doesn't prove itself in practice. In practice, a Prius engine lasts forever. Someone will jump in to complain about some anecdotal failure but the fleet statistics are strong. They even outlast other non-hybrid Toyotas. There are a lot of reasons for this but a significant one is the lack of belt-driven accessories, lack of friction clutches, and ability to avoid high-stress operation because of the electric side of the power train.
This is exactly correct, and I can't count how many times I've had to have this argument, thank you for pointing it out.
My hybrid (not a Prius, actually) doesn't have a dedicated starter motor, the traction motor starts the ICE engine. The climate control is electric and powered by the hybrid battery (with the added benefit of being able to run the A/C while the ICE engine is off). The power steering is electric so there's no hydraulic power steering pump to fail. I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting. Mechanically, it's just simpler than an ICE engine alone.
> ability to avoid high-stress operation because of the electric side of the power train.
This one is huge, also, and people always forget about it, so thank you for raising it. ICE hate being heavily loaded at low RPMs (also known as "lugging"), and the electric motors alleviate a lot of that low-end workload. It's a big win not just for efficiency, but also drivability, as almost all non-diesel engines make terrible torque low in their RPM range.
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It may be aesthetic now but it will become economic soon enough. There is just no way a complicated hybrid system stays price competitive with a dumb simple electric motors and some batteries. Hybrids will end up more expensive as batteries drop rapidly in price - the gas engine and system costs are mature and thus fixed and will not decline. Batteries get substantially cheaper and better every year. Hybrids have a short economically viable window whose days are numbered (I personally think 2026 is the last year they’ll compete in many markets)