Comment by esalman
1 day ago
I received my green card in 2023 and I have mixed emotions.
On one hand, I'm so relieved that I have been able to dodge everything that the administration has been throwing at immigrant (legal and illegal alike), trying to see what sticks, like mass deportations, border wall expansion, visa restrictions, asylum crackdown, H-1B cuts, and chain Migration Ban.
On the other hand, we cannot apply for citizenship for 3 more years, even though me and my wife have been in the US for combined 25+ years, and paid over $100,000 in taxes last year alone, and it's jarring to imagine what the administration will come up with next to make the process less straightforward than it seems.
Most disturbing is the fact that a lot of people I know who climbed the same ladder will go out and cheer what the administration is doing.
I received mine in 2020 and have decided to move back home. The uncertainty in general just keeps me up at night. Feels like the goalposts could move at any moment. I know I'm likely overreacting but it is what it is.
If anything everyone else is under reacting.
You have ICE officers randomly abducting people off appearance alone and then detaining them for days if not weeks. If you were a citizen the whole time, cool who cares.
No one in America has any rights.
That aside, even as someone who's been in this country for generations, I've been exploring options to leave.
America is behind most of the developed world in terms of standards of living. I was in Asia for a while and I felt a fraction of the fear I constantly do at home.
It's not getting better.
GC holder of 25 years with citizen parents. I agree with you and I stress about this daily. It's always been a shitty deal though - we are taxed with no representation in government.
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America is also run by a cabal of pedophiles and despite that being pretty out in the open at this point, there have been no consequences for them at all. It's not a good looking situation when even CSA and genocide are met with an "eh, what can you do?" shrug by a populace that has been led to accept worse and worse every year.
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Gave back my green card the moment I left the US. No longer wanted the hassle and ties to an unpredictable regime. Haven’t looked back.
I don't think you're overreacting. Received mine in 2020 and decided to move as well.
Not just uncertainty, but the apparent speedrunning of making the US an undesirable place to live compared to other countries.
Where did you move to and what are you doing now? (I'd love to hear from anyone else who's left too)
> and paid over $100,000 in taxes last year alone
Genuinely curious, what does taxes have to do with it? Everyone pays taxes, legal or illegal in some form.
I don’t think paying your dues should make you more likely to get through the pipeline. After all, you paid those taxes because you made good money, which is what people come here for.
I think the point is that they are contributing to the US, and were the best option for their employer, and are supporting their communities, etc.
All things that we should be supporting if we are indeed wishing our nation to prosper.
A plurality of Americans don’t pay federal income taxes, so we’re essentially turning away someone who is building up our country.
> A plurality of Americans don’t pay federal income taxes
What does a plurality even mean here? This is a binary question, so plurality and majority are the same thing. And I don't think it is factually correct that the majority of Americans do not pay income taxes.
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> So we’re essentially turning away someone who is building up our country.
They're not being turned away. There's a requirement to be in the country for 5 years with a green card before citizenship. It seems to me that they are just upset that they have to follow the rules which aren't hurting them at all.
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Someone else would have taken that job maybe for a higher salary.
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Taxes are supposed to pay for public services. An efficient visa system is a public service. If you pay tons of taxes but don’t get a public service that’s personally very important to you, it’s natural to feel let down
Yeah that’s fair, I feel let down all the time with how my taxes are (ab)used. Not a surprise, It’s been like this as long as I can remember.
You have to do a lot when you get a green card to prove you won't be a burden on the US tax payer. It's a big part of the system and a big part of the anti-immigrant rhetoric
> Genuinely curious, what does taxes have to do with it?
It's popular trope from the GOP that immigrants are an economic drain on the US. They get free <insert whatever you want>, so the US must throw them out to save money.
A lot of the anti-immigrant rhetoric involves some version of the lie that immigrants don't pay taxes.
Citizenship is tied to the right to vote and Taxation without Representation was literally the driving force for the creation of America itself
> Taxation without Representation was literally the driving force for the creation of America itself
The issue of taxation without representation had far more to do with the founders’ status as Englishmen and British subjects than their status as taxpayers. Paying taxes by itself was not a sufficient qualification for political representation. Felons, minors, and women were also required to pay taxes in the 1770s, despite not being able to vote. Immigrants who believe that the taxes they pay entitle them to this representation have bought into a falsified version of American history that was popularized during the Civil Rights Era.
United States Congress, “An act to establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization,” March 26, 1790:
> Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America, in Congress assembled, That any Alien being a free white person, who shall have resided within the limits and under the jurisdiction of the United States for the term of two years, may be admitted to become a citizen thereof on application to any common law Court of record in any one of the States wherein he shall have resided for the term of one year at least, and making proof to the satisfaction of such Court that he is a person of good character, and taking the oath or affirmation prescribed by law to support the Constitution of the United States, which Oath or Affirmation such Court shall administer, and the Clerk of such Court shall record such Application, and the proceedings thereon; and thereupon such person shall be considered as a Citizen of the United States.
> I don’t think paying your dues should make you more likely to get through the pipeline. After all, you paid those taxes because you made good money, which is what people come here for.
https://www.trumpcard.gov/
> After all, you paid those taxes because you made good money, which is what people come here for.
You mean they’ve contributed generously for the compensation they’ve earned?
One can reasonably argue that not paying your dues should exclude you from the pipeline.
Uncle Sam likes tax payers.
To show that they're not freeloaders. A lot of right-wingers have a belief that immigrants are implicitly freeloaders, and therefore getting rid of them will make the economy better.
Of course it's just not true. Like most current Republican talking points, it's plainly fabricated; it's an outright lie. But, since a lot of people believe it, it's useful to reminder everyone that its not the case.
Signaling.
A very common xenophobic narrative is that foreigners do two things at the same time (1) steal your jobs and (2) drain your social systems. Another even more vile one one would be anything to do with coming for your daughters and women, but for this you will have to favtor in race. Because a rich white Frenchman coming your daughter doesn't have the same ring to it for bigots.
If the US, a country with a too low birthrate, throws out even the best kind of migrant (namely the kind that generates a lot of value for the country), you're going to be in deeper shit than ever before for decades to come.
Now I agree that paying taxes or not should have nothing to do with it.
It's not just a narrative and has been proven true, at least for (2).[0]
For (1), I think that a good discussion with any business owner in a migrant-dominated field will tell you that hiring foreigners is done to keep costs low and avoid Baumol's law. As a result, locals don't want to work in such fields, reinforcing the need for migrants.
[0] https://scanalyst.fourmilab.ch/uploads/default/original/2X/9...
Have you tried being white? The trump admin is rolling out the red carpet for white south Africans.
I'm being facetious of course. I hate what maga is doing to our wonderful melting pot.
Don’t listen to this op, you don’t need to change your race.
If I was you I’d choose to be a multi-billionaire instead and keep my race.
What's with tax thing? Is it only paid in US? Are they not supposed to pay taxes when they have taxable income?
If one paid 100K+ in taxes I assume one had opportunities to make such high income by being in US which one can be thankful for.
> On the other hand, we cannot apply for citizenship for 3 more years, ...
I am sorry but I am just seeing too much of an entitlement here.
I got mine in 2019 and feel the same way. I'm actually in the process of applying for citizenship and my application seems to have stalled - it's been nearly 10 months when the USCIS processing times page says I should expect 7 (it was 5-6 when I applied). There's been some articles that the government is going to force everyone to retake fingerprints again although there's been nothing official about that yet. I really wish I had applied for citizenship as soon as I was eligible.
I was approved 2 weeks ago. The process took 4 years end to end. I've been updating my paperwork (SSN, Global Entry and CA DL). I saw this news and immediately thought that it would've impacted me and I wouldn't've been able to maintain my job until a consular interview.
Also a consular interview has no appeal process. A denial stands unlike AOS.
If it makes you feel any better, and I’m sure it won’t. There are US citizens outraged by this as well. And I’m one of them.
"Most disturbing is the fact that a lot of people I know who climbed the same ladder will go out and cheer what the administration is doing."
I always joke that all naturalized (citizens) immigrants automatically become republican. I say it in earnest because effectively all naturalized people who I know side with anti-immigration, except agaisnt people they know, but none of them take my "joke" seriously.
Even those still halfway up said ladder: https://x.com/flowersslop/status/2058161240350794165?s=20
This shit is sadly true.
I am paying taxes in US for over 20 years, don't hold a green card, not interested in ever getting one and not complaining that I don't have the right to vote. How are these things related?
Not entirely safe even if you naturalize as they are now making noise about stripping citizenship[1]
[1] https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/trump-administr...
They're doing this on the basis that crimes were committed before naturalization so therefore the N-400 submitted was fraudulent.
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I’m An immigrant, so I can relate. Not in the US.
I left my home country for a better life.
If the country I moved to was going downhill, I’d be looking to move again. I already did it, so I know it’s worthwhile.
> me and my wife have been in the US for combined 25+ years, and paid over $100,000 in
Sounds like you may be a good candidate for Trump's gold card.
I'm being fecitious of course, but I'm just pointing out that thinking of citizenship worthiness in monetary terms is something the president has already considered.
i’m fairly confident the gold card is the only kind of immigration they want to encourage now. you either pay up or go home and cross your fingers
America is not an economic opportunity zone.
"Land of Opportunity" is in fact a long-used nickname for the United States, so your position appears to be mostly rejected.
That was literally the premise of America at its foundation, and it’s a better national identity than this weird, ahistorical attempt at white christian nationhood currently popular on the American right.
It is not as a country. Certain regions within the nation are still growing.