Comment by bluegatty
1 day ago
"an easy solution: increase the number of legal immigrants we allow."
Not really.
The answer is: have a fair, transparent and function system.
Then - yes - you can totally 'increase' (or decrease) as needed.
'Increase a bit' likely the right thing to do - but it's a completely separate question.
But throwing Green Card holders out is completely insane, grabbing people out of church and schools and putting them into detention without oversight is cruel and inhumane.
The national debate is insane.
Just basic, normal, reasonable policy and process.
That's it.
Like DMV level stuff.
Then you can adjust the numbers one way or another.
> Then you can adjust the numbers one way or another.
The numbers need to go up.
China, in particular, has an "elite overproduction" problem. We should be welcoming every English-speaking Chinese STEM degree holder with open arms.
Anyone, from anywhere, with a STEM degree and a job offer from a US company, should be in this country. Period.
America needs to be the leader of the knowledge workforce world. We also need a vibrant and wealthy tax base and consumer base.
If we don't do this, China and other up-and-coming nations will increasingly start to displace us, which puts all of our workers at a disadvantage.
There are already far too many US college grads who can’t get jobs. I have friends who had 1500+ SAT scores with stem degrees who never found meaningful work. Give these people jobs before you give it to the Chinese.
+ Green Cards are mostly for spouses.
+ "Give these people jobs before you give it to the Chinese." is just slightly racist, I'm not saying it's entirely objectionable, but you could just say 'non-citizen'.
+ It's way harder to hire someone on H1B than a local. There is a reason they are being hired. 1500+ SAT is nice but it's not magic entry point for a job.
There are definitely some kinds of jobs - 'Plain IT' where Tata and some Indian companies are just 'India First'. That's H1B abuse.
But by and large, that's not the case.
It's better to consider 'tightening up the program' if you think it should be, as opposed to making very broad considerations.
'Broad Brushstroke' stopping of these programs will definitely hurt the US.
> There are already far too many US college grads who can’t get jobs.
Recent college grads have had a harder time, but is slowly improving again [1]. All college grads are around 3% which is usually considered full employment. It was so easy for so long, any reversion to normal is met with the sky is falling. We haven't really seen that yet. The job market is also much much larger than big tech.
In my own experience trying to hire people, it's hard to filter real resumes from fakes/garbage. I have to think this issue is making it slower to hire recent grads.
[1] https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/college-labor-market#--:...
That's just DEI. We just got rid of that with much fanfare.
1) The US has a much greater 'Elite Over Production' problem than does China. China produces a lot of people with decent education that can' find work but that's not 'Elite Overproduction'.
Frankly EO is just a sign of a developed nation.
2) "Anyone, from anywhere, with a STEM degree and a job offer from a US company, should be in this country"
Since when did citizenship become about 'Economic Production'?
The vast majority of the people of the world don't agree with this - and this is kind of one of the roots of disagreement over migration.
Yes - surely 'educated migrants' are good and helpful, but that's only part of the equation.
3) "If we don't do this, China and other up-and-coming nations will increasingly start to displace us"?
Displace you how exactly?
All of this hints of 'Nationalist Industrial Capitalism' with hints of fear mongering. "But China's Gonna Get Us!" ... listen I get it - but this card is played a bit too hard, too often.
Also absent is the fact that there's a need to help refugees etc.
The US surprisingly takes surprisingly few refugees in from conflicts zones, even those it calamities it participates in.
Consider that a 'Nation' is a 'Community' - not a 'Business Centre' and that education and economic competitiveness are just parts of that consideration.
Ultimately, it's a choice, and those points are not invalid, but probably should be contextualized in the grander scheme of how most people define their communities.
America is the leader of the knowledge workforce world and that aint gonna change. We aren't getting displaced anytime soon. One look at the pay differential makes it clear where incentives lie
"We aren't getting displaced anytime soon. One look at the pay differential makes it clear where incentives lie"
This is a bit myopic, partly because it diminishes Chinese capabilities - they're definitely ahead in a few areas, notably battery tech, advanced manufacturing, and in some product categories like robotics, (arguably EVs) and they have demonstrated leadership in industrial capacity for many others, like Solar Panels, other things. They're less than 1 year behind on AI (admittedly, they 'distill' and do a lot of copying but there's legit Engineering going on).
When you put that altogether, and the pace of progress, it's formidable.
China does it with 'domestic talent' whereas US R&D and 'Tech Exceptionalism' would literally not exist without outsiders, who make up up to 1/2 of the primary innovations, companies etc.. Tesla, Nvidia, OpenAI, Google - so many critical people from Europe, Asia etc. None of the 'Godfathers of AI' are American (which I find odd actually). Europe in particular makes a ton of primary contributions which are leveraged by others.
It's not a reason to say 'anyone from tech can be a citizen' but immigration has to be recognized as a critical ingredient, maybe the most critical.