Comment by peteforde
21 hours ago
Pi's refusal to drop a USB-C on Pico due to cost increases is a terrible call IMO.
I seriously cannot fathom being someone doing development who wouldn't pay $0.50 extra to purge the last micro USB from their desktop.
A very small point, but pulling from a feather form factor BOM to compare.
$0.12 for microUSB female connector (rated 1A) $0.26 for a USB-C female (rated 3A). Needs 2 x resistors (< $0.01), 20% larger board area
I think the power capabilities are the biggest item. If you want to pull higher current from a laptop for development or supply from a wall, you have to switch to USB-C.
I don't think either of these prices are that aggressive - pretty sure the cost comes down at volume.
I wonder if it would be worthwhile for them to produce both. Well, it will be hard to compare because the design cost doesn’t show up in the BOM, haha.
But it seems like it would be useful nowadays, since some laptop have mostly USB-C connectors, and USB-C to USB-C is pretty common. I’ve never seen a C to Micro. Do they even exist?
I have an unfair bias because I design PCBs as a significant part of my job, and switching out to USB on this board appears to be a non-issue.
I have a Pico in front of me, and there's plenty of room there for a USB-C footprint and the two 5.1k resistors. Given that, I cannot reasonably agree that the "design" stage is significant.
In other words, it's a change that I would make to my own board in 2-5 minutes because the stakes are low. My ballpark guess is that such a change at RPi would have to go through a proposal stage, a PCB change review, and then there would be dozens of places to update documentation.
Since backwards compatibility is non-optional, this would result in a separate SKU, which means that the whole distribution chain needs to be updated with a new product.
So, I acknowledge that when you're working at their scale any change like this is the definition of non-trivial. What I don't agree with is the conclusion that it's not still clearly the right thing to do.
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> I’ve never seen a C to Micro. Do they even exist?
They do, in spades: https://www.amazon.com/3FT-Micro-Data-Charge-Cable/dp/B0DDWH...
I look forward to the day when they're no longer necessary.
I've always used USB-C to USB-A dongle + USB-A to micro B.
But then you loose market share to ESP32 where people just get USB C on their own.
Comparing an RP2350 to the ESP32 family (which is broad) is very much apples to oranges; they each have feature sets which make them ideal for completely different use cases.
I get my USB-C connectors at around $0.08 at low volumes (LCSC).
https://www.mouser.de/ProductDetail/Same-Sky/UJ20-C-H-G-MSMT...
I'm on a phone that makes it a pain in the ass to switch languages. Do it yourself.
I cannot fathom why USB-C would make any difference. It's not like USB-C is intrinsically better for this use case? If you're doing hardware development, your desk is likely full of in-development crap anyway and a micro USB cable more or less won't make any difference whatsoever, nor is the Pico likely to the only thing needing a micro USB cable.
Edit: one thing I can think of where micro USB connectors are better: if you broke off the connector, it's much easier to solder it back on.
Micro USB is relatively brittle and can only be inserted in one direction. It means you have to make sure you have the old cable for this one thing. There's no USB-PD and you can't do USB host mode.
USB-C is the opposite of all those cons: much more durable, not directionally opinionated, you can use one cable for everything, you can do USB host and USB-PD.
It's also clearly the future everything is standardizing on. There's value in embracing that, since it is a Reference Board.
USB-C is a better connector in every aspect. Micro USB is a terrible connector. It's that simple.
The economics don't add up either, because an adapter cable costs money too.
> If you're doing hardware development, your desk is likely full of in-development crap anyway
Sure when you're at home, if you have a stable home. It's one more cable to bring if you don't, or if you ever travel and stay in a hotel.
For what it's worth there are third-party rp2350 boards with USB-C connectors if that's important to you. Heck, WaveShare has one with two USB-C connectors: https://www.waveshare.com/rp2350-usb-c.htm
I was just needing exactly something that for my project, thank you!
This way, I can have my laptop running codex control over a target laptop, by pretending to be a keyboard.
I am aware, thanks.
I do think that you're missing my point, which is that we're significantly past the point in this wretched timeline where they should offer a USB-C version of the reference board for this MCU.
Oh, no, I'm with you. The fewer connector types we have to use, the better. My comment was meant as an FYI for you or anyone else who wasn't aware and not as a dismissal of your valid criticism.
They probably just bought a shit ton of micro USB connectors back in the day and want to use them up, or something silly like that. It would be funny if the EU forced them to switch to USB-C.
You can at least buy USB-C boards from other vendors since they sell the rp2040/rp2350 separately. If you want wifi it gets a little more complicated unfortunately.
i understand that if they implement a port, it is usually well done (besides the unfortunate 27.1w 5a bs for the rpi5). so unlike cheapo electronics that do come with barely working type c.
however, while in one hand we are happy to (albeit temporarily) raise prices based on ram situation, in terms of design, there is simply not enough money for the port. especially when now they are adding ecosystem items that do cost money to develop and maintain.
this explanation made sense pre-ipo but no longer imho.
There are broadly available third party RP2350 boards with subc and a variety of additional capabilities if that is important for you.
https://shop.pimoroni.com/en-us/collections/rp2350
https://www.sparkfun.com/sparkfun-pro-micro-rp2350.html
https://www.dfrobot.com/product-2913.html
https://www.seeedstudio.com/Seeed-XIAO-RP2350-p-5944.html
Not the point, though I appreciate folks listing links in an attempt to help.
What I am saying is that we're well into 2026 and there's no good reason for RPi not to offer a USB-C version of the reference board for this MCU.
The good reason is that there are plenty of third party boards that already offer what you want. There’s very little to be gained by an ‘official’ one. The next one probably should have C, if just because it is the Euro standard, but no urgent need to backport.
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While we're at it, their reference board also doesn't have a reset button, it just has one for boot. It's perhaps one of the most inconvenient official dev boards I've ever used in modern times.
It's not $0.50 extra. It's $0.16 extra for a USB-C port assuming you bought the USB-C port on mouser at 10k quantities and threw the micro USB port away.
I just don't get it. Anyone who wants to save a few pennies just buys the chip directly. Their Pico board is primarily for prototyping and one off products, where quality of life is everything and 16 cents is nothing. The adapter cable probably costs more than the amount they saved. That's a dick move.
Unpopular opinion but I actually enjoy using USB Micro B more than USB-C. That's because USB-C is much more complicated and there're non-standard-compliant cables floating in the market. USB-C also has some fancy mode like voltage selection. If it got screwed up somehow leading it to supply the wrong voltage, it could fry your Pico board.
That and a reset button.