Comment by 4gotunameagain

1 day ago

A simple search supports my argument:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine%E2%80%93NATO_relations...

Also go back and listen to old speeches and interviews by Putin and Lavrov. They have been crystal clear about that fact, saying it openly that they will even invade if NATO tries to get too close.

I empathise with the Ukrainian people who are the ones that have to suffer from these power games, but I place a lot of blame to NATO.

3 comments

4gotunameagain

mopsi 20 hours ago

Timeline from the article you linked does not support your argument:

  During the 2010 presidential election campaign, Party of Regions leader and candidate Viktor Yanukovych stated that the current level of Ukraine's cooperation with NATO was sufficient and that the question of the country's accession to the alliance was therefore not urgent. On 14 February 2010, Yanukovych said that Ukraine's relations with NATO were currently "well-defined", and that there was "no question of Ukraine joining NATO". 

  In February 2014, during Ukraine's Revolution of Dignity, president Yanukovych fled the capital despite signing an agreement with the opposition. Parliament voted to remove Yanukovych from his post and schedule new elections, while an interim government was set up. 

  Ukraine's interim Yatsenyuk government took office on 26 February. The new government said that it did not intend to make Ukraine a member of NATO.

  In late February and early March 2014, Russian soldiers without insignia occupied Crimea.

As to Putin and Lavrov, they didn't even admit the invasion after the fact, which is why Russian soldiers were running around without insignia for the first few years of the war.

4gotunameagain 9 hours ago
How exactly does it not support it ? Stop with your propaganda.
On 9 February 2021, the prime minister of Ukraine, Denys Shmyhal, stated that he hoped that Ukraine would be able to receive an action plan for NATO membership at the same time as Georgia On 7 April 2021, after the start of the build-up of Russian troops near the Ukrainian border
And your last point lacks logic, the fact that they did not admit that they invaded does not invalidate the fact that they issued multiple and continuous warnings to Ukraine and NATO.
Can't you see that you are the victim of the US military industrial complex ?
- mopsi 2 hours ago
  
  Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014, and by 2021, Ukraine and Russia were in the 8th year of the war.
  The Russian "multiple and continuous warnings" (aka demands and ultimatums) were taken seriously in 2008 and Ukraine was not offered a path to NATO membership. Didn't save them from the invasion. The 2008 decision is now widely considered a mistake. The "Russia is afraid of NATO encirclement" argument has been conclusively falsified for a while now.