- 30-50% pay cut
- points and lottery based immigration system that penalizes them for each year you age after 30
- frequent unfavorable rule changes
- fear of being trapped forever on a temporary visa and eventually sent back to the USA, poorer than their peers who stayed stateside.
Canadian citizen moves to us on equivalent CUSMA visa:
- huge pay raise
- retire back home wealthier than their peers and still enjoy socialized healthcare.
Canada's immigration system is just structurally tilted toward brain drain. It's all stick and no carrot.
Personally, I would go to Toronto. Decades ago I used to work for a Canadian company headquartered in Toronto and had development offices in the states. There was a project I needed to do with a distinguished engineer that required me to move to Toronto for a few months. I really liked it. TBH, there are very few cities in the US that I would say are on par with Toronto, and none are better. Now the Winters are brutal, but they're brutal where I'm from so that's not a dealbreaker for me.
For a country that has been a "brain magnet" for a good century, a "brain drain" might just be "talented people from wherever choosing to go somewhere else".
Case in point: an EE I know who is finishing his master's[1] is considering interesting proposals from solid (but not top tier, think Texas not Massachusetts) universities from the US, Germany and China. While he's afraid of the culture gap with China, it's clearly the one that has the more interesting things going on technically and the one he feels more excited about
[1]Engineering by itself is a bachelor's level degree here
HK will give you right of abode which is almost as good as citizenship so long as you stay in HK. I suppose you could still be deported for high crimes or some such but that almost seems like the best case scenario if that happens.
Higher intangible quality of life, lower spending power.
There are a lot of QOL advantages to living in a less violent, less polarized, less cruelty-driven society that isn't actively trying to dismantle all of its institutions and destroy itself. Especially if you're one of those people who are in the crosshairs of jack-booted thugs and their cheerleaders.
He said Canada man. If you had other reasonable options when leaving you wouldn't pick it so lets not pretend anyone moving there from the USA didn't fail already.
not much talent is going from US to Canada, it's almost always the reverse if you look at top canadian universities
Here’s evidence from 2025. 2026 has increased.
https://www.aau.edu/sites/default/files/Resources-American-S...
US citizen moves to Canada on a CUSMA visa:
Canadian citizen moves to us on equivalent CUSMA visa:
Canada's immigration system is just structurally tilted toward brain drain. It's all stick and no carrot.
where in Canada? i've _never_ heard that, but if so, great.
Personally, I would go to Toronto. Decades ago I used to work for a Canadian company headquartered in Toronto and had development offices in the states. There was a project I needed to do with a distinguished engineer that required me to move to Toronto for a few months. I really liked it. TBH, there are very few cities in the US that I would say are on par with Toronto, and none are better. Now the Winters are brutal, but they're brutal where I'm from so that's not a dealbreaker for me.
Are people really moving to China? A country that will never give outsiders citizenship?
For a country that has been a "brain magnet" for a good century, a "brain drain" might just be "talented people from wherever choosing to go somewhere else".
Case in point: an EE I know who is finishing his master's[1] is considering interesting proposals from solid (but not top tier, think Texas not Massachusetts) universities from the US, Germany and China. While he's afraid of the culture gap with China, it's clearly the one that has the more interesting things going on technically and the one he feels more excited about
[1]Engineering by itself is a bachelor's level degree here
Probably more that China is producing more new talent through education, and Chinese scientists and researchers moving back to China.
you wouldn't want citizenship anyway; safer to remain a foreigner while living/working there, even long-term
HK will give you right of abode which is almost as good as citizenship so long as you stay in HK. I suppose you could still be deported for high crimes or some such but that almost seems like the best case scenario if that happens.
Canada? For lower salary and lower life quality?
Higher intangible quality of life, lower spending power.
There are a lot of QOL advantages to living in a less violent, less polarized, less cruelty-driven society that isn't actively trying to dismantle all of its institutions and destroy itself. Especially if you're one of those people who are in the crosshairs of jack-booted thugs and their cheerleaders.
He said Canada man. If you had other reasonable options when leaving you wouldn't pick it so lets not pretend anyone moving there from the USA didn't fail already.