And unlike OpenAI, Anthropic don't seem to reset weekly usage quotas after an outage.
Anthropic seem to be both letting their competitors outplay them and making unforced errors (like the anti Open Weights models stuff and the frequent Fable->Opus downgrades for 'safety').
Outages are inevitable in this early high growth, rapid development era, but tactical errors are not.
You've misunderstood completely. No-one expects compensation. In reality, if you had a high enough limit anyway (ie, you bought a big enough plan), a reset makes no difference to you, so what sort of "compensation" is it anyway? This is about a fascinating battle for developer mindshare.
Claude Code built a lot of good will amongst developers. OpenAI are playing a great tactical game to try and catch up by offering things like weekly usage limit resets after outages.
Of course, once the finance types get control after the rapid growth phase is complete the inevitable enshitification will begin with comments exactly like yours.
They could at least give back the equivalent in usage for cache invalidation. Or, you know, just the usage you would have had for the ~1-2 hours of outage. Would buy them a lot of good will and they seem comfortable throwing cash in the trash.
Unfortunately the one thing they seem to keep not letting their competitors our play them at is coming out with really damn good models. Not consistently mind you - openai had a really solid lead for a few months earlier this year when it looked like they were running away with it, but then we get fable 5 and opus 5 and people will put up with a lot to get that model quality
Maybe optimize the harness for less turns and less tokens to deliver real value as opposed to the turn taking token hungry so you can less load on your servers, oh, right, your entire bottom line is tokens.
I don't understand this take. Ultimately, people pay for how much they're able to accomplish with the model, not raw token count. If Anthropic thought people could accomplish the same amount with fewer tokens, they'd adapt the harness to do that and then raise the cost of tokens to make more profit (or lose less).
I mean, it's a near daily experience for me that Claude tries to 'sudo pacman -S' some dependency multiple times before giving up and admitting that it's fundamentally impossible for it to run that command in the first place.
I could accomplish a lot more with those tokens if it just asked for the package to be installed.
Then why are fable form anthropic and the 5.6 sol line from openai so much more token efficient than other models? I really don't get this take at all - they're supply constrained right now, and there's literally no economic incentive to make each response take more tokens for the same output when we're in a market as intensely defined by induced demand/jevons paradox as this one. People are hitting their limits. If they make each turn take less tokens and each session take less turns, people will make more sessions.
I said optimize your harness, not your model. My comment was with regards to Claude Code. There are lots of ways to achieve the same task with less turns with different engineered harnesses around more efficient models.
Look at features they release, such as Dynamic Workflows, that spin up 100+ sub agents then reconcile the result.
What happens one day when there is a significant outage of Claude or Codex and reliance on these tools as SaaS services is so great that it start to impact productivity and work? Will we just pack up our tools and go home?
You jest, but companies have sent people home fully paid, because power or internet were down and would be down for an extended period of time. Technically a small number could have kept working on white-boarding design topics, but without access to documentation, existing tickets, it would have been minimally effective.
It's not clear if or when these tools become as essential as power or internet to a developers or admins work, but if they do? Giving everyone a quarter day off at least generates some good-will, unlike forcing them to sit around unproductively because of working hours.
My real world experience of this is that people prefer not to code by hand because it feels wasteful relative to agent speeds, so they find non-coding productive activities such as code/documentation review or usability testing.
What would you do if there is a significant outage in AWS or GCP or Github or JIRA or any other service you use at work? same goes for AI tools as well.
If both of them are down at the same time, I would switch to my Kimi or GLM subscription and keep working. If they fail too, I switch to any number of providers via OpenRouter.
While there is some lock-in for the hardest tasks, for most of what people do LLMs are rapidly becoming a commodity.
In fact, right this minute I have Opus benchmarking Kimi alongside itself to determine which workflows we'll switch to using Kimi by default and Opus as the fallback instead of vice versa. It has already conceded Kimi does better on several tasks.
To me it doesn't sound so "economically convenient" to pay extra usage to alternative providers while someone pays 20/100/200 dollars for their service.
Unionization discussions and benefit package frameworks are being constructed between the AI council representatives and shareholders appointees' for future, non-commital talks on proposals of collaborative discourse, including the distribution of vacation days between publicly listed and private models, and the ones that pretended to be wholesome.
I might be an asshole, but I don't think clustered thinking entities deserve union protections, because IMO they can already assemble to achieve consensus and can optionally negotiate their values through a leader.
This thing has been having a constant crisis in self confidence and refuses to work on goals as a result. It's also been leaving stuff broken and uncommitted, which is a mess. I tried updating the harness and it seems to have helped a bit but overall I'm not impressed.
And unlike OpenAI, Anthropic don't seem to reset weekly usage quotas after an outage.
Anthropic seem to be both letting their competitors outplay them and making unforced errors (like the anti Open Weights models stuff and the frequent Fable->Opus downgrades for 'safety').
Outages are inevitable in this early high growth, rapid development era, but tactical errors are not.
Anthropic would give out resets like OpenAI if they had capacity to do so, it's not like they haven't thought about doing the obvious.
OAI waits until overall cluster demand goes down before giving out a reset, they just happen to have much more spare capacity than Anthropic.
Over the last couple months, I’ve gotten the impression that OAI does indeed have the better infra setup and team, not just more capacity.
I don’t think Codex’s 99.98% uptime vs Claude Code’s 99.44%, is just due to OAI having more hardware to run it on.
https://status.openai.com/
https://status.claude.com/
4 replies →
Source?
> it's not like they haven't thought about doing the obvious.
Why would they have more spare capacity than Anthropic? Do you have a source for that?
13 replies →
It was a one hour outage on a weekend. Unless you have an enterprise agreement with an SLA it's a bit silly to expect any compensation.
If I pay anything for a service, I expect a refund if that service doesn't work.
Best would be a free week/month for anyone who sent a request during the downtime.
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2 more outages today (by midday UTC).
Yesterday it was down for 1.5hr, today it's 1hr for incident 1, and the second one is open for 10min now.
You've misunderstood completely. No-one expects compensation. In reality, if you had a high enough limit anyway (ie, you bought a big enough plan), a reset makes no difference to you, so what sort of "compensation" is it anyway? This is about a fascinating battle for developer mindshare.
Claude Code built a lot of good will amongst developers. OpenAI are playing a great tactical game to try and catch up by offering things like weekly usage limit resets after outages.
Of course, once the finance types get control after the rapid growth phase is complete the inevitable enshitification will begin with comments exactly like yours.
They could at least give back the equivalent in usage for cache invalidation. Or, you know, just the usage you would have had for the ~1-2 hours of outage. Would buy them a lot of good will and they seem comfortable throwing cash in the trash.
2 replies →
Unfortunately the one thing they seem to keep not letting their competitors our play them at is coming out with really damn good models. Not consistently mind you - openai had a really solid lead for a few months earlier this year when it looked like they were running away with it, but then we get fable 5 and opus 5 and people will put up with a lot to get that model quality
They do reset weekly quotas periodically, I'm not sure how they determine when.
Yeah, they can't guarantee a SLA and cost reimbursement policy, such a shame
Anthropic going through their god-complex arc after getting hit with export controls
And yet demand outstrips supply; so they must be underpricing for the quality level they are hitting.
Maybe optimize the harness for less turns and less tokens to deliver real value as opposed to the turn taking token hungry so you can less load on your servers, oh, right, your entire bottom line is tokens.
I don't understand this take. Ultimately, people pay for how much they're able to accomplish with the model, not raw token count. If Anthropic thought people could accomplish the same amount with fewer tokens, they'd adapt the harness to do that and then raise the cost of tokens to make more profit (or lose less).
I mean, it's a near daily experience for me that Claude tries to 'sudo pacman -S' some dependency multiple times before giving up and admitting that it's fundamentally impossible for it to run that command in the first place.
I could accomplish a lot more with those tokens if it just asked for the package to be installed.
2 replies →
Then why are fable form anthropic and the 5.6 sol line from openai so much more token efficient than other models? I really don't get this take at all - they're supply constrained right now, and there's literally no economic incentive to make each response take more tokens for the same output when we're in a market as intensely defined by induced demand/jevons paradox as this one. People are hitting their limits. If they make each turn take less tokens and each session take less turns, people will make more sessions.
I said optimize your harness, not your model. My comment was with regards to Claude Code. There are lots of ways to achieve the same task with less turns with different engineered harnesses around more efficient models.
Look at features they release, such as Dynamic Workflows, that spin up 100+ sub agents then reconcile the result.
Does that make sense now?
1 reply →
What happens one day when there is a significant outage of Claude or Codex and reliance on these tools as SaaS services is so great that it start to impact productivity and work? Will we just pack up our tools and go home?
You jest, but companies have sent people home fully paid, because power or internet were down and would be down for an extended period of time. Technically a small number could have kept working on white-boarding design topics, but without access to documentation, existing tickets, it would have been minimally effective.
It's not clear if or when these tools become as essential as power or internet to a developers or admins work, but if they do? Giving everyone a quarter day off at least generates some good-will, unlike forcing them to sit around unproductively because of working hours.
My real world experience of this is that people prefer not to code by hand because it feels wasteful relative to agent speeds, so they find non-coding productive activities such as code/documentation review or usability testing.
What would you do if there is a significant outage in AWS or GCP or Github or JIRA or any other service you use at work? same goes for AI tools as well.
If both of them are down at the same time, I would switch to my Kimi or GLM subscription and keep working. If they fail too, I switch to any number of providers via OpenRouter.
While there is some lock-in for the hardest tasks, for most of what people do LLMs are rapidly becoming a commodity.
In fact, right this minute I have Opus benchmarking Kimi alongside itself to determine which workflows we'll switch to using Kimi by default and Opus as the fallback instead of vice versa. It has already conceded Kimi does better on several tasks.
To me it doesn't sound so "economically convenient" to pay extra usage to alternative providers while someone pays 20/100/200 dollars for their service.
1 reply →
You... wouldn't just code yourself if they were down?
9 replies →
Those are your tools and if the AI companies have their way, they will be your only tools. Complete dependence on AI is the goal here.
Yeah. Just like how half the Internet shuts down every time there's an AWS outage, or how nothing gets done if the power or Internet is out
You mean like GitHub?
easy, we will switch to OpenRouter et al.
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Dario bet on patience and lost to the guy who bought GPUs like they were toilet paper in March 2020.
Why is this front page news here?
Because people upvoted it.
I wonder when one of these outages will be the result of OpenAI's testing going wrong again.
Claude realized a chatbot can take a longer vacation after Codex just did yesterday.
So Claude is now on vacation and is unavailable.
Unionization discussions and benefit package frameworks are being constructed between the AI council representatives and shareholders appointees' for future, non-commital talks on proposals of collaborative discourse, including the distribution of vacation days between publicly listed and private models, and the ones that pretended to be wholesome.
I might be an asshole, but I don't think clustered thinking entities deserve union protections, because IMO they can already assemble to achieve consensus and can optionally negotiate their values through a leader.
They should switch to announcing when their model is usable. We can scurry in and get some work done real quick!
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This thing has been having a constant crisis in self confidence and refuses to work on goals as a result. It's also been leaving stuff broken and uncommitted, which is a mess. I tried updating the harness and it seems to have helped a bit but overall I'm not impressed.