Comment by crooked-v
5 hours ago
It's absolutely the moral thing. Even on HN there are an endless number of people who treat the use of GLP-1s as a failure that must be publicly shamed.
5 hours ago
It's absolutely the moral thing. Even on HN there are an endless number of people who treat the use of GLP-1s as a failure that must be publicly shamed.
I suspect a big part of that stems from the fact that many people treat being overweight as a moral failure in and of itself, and rather than repenting and doing the morally right and correct thing to lose the weight on your own, using a GLP-1 is "cheating".
Of course, all that ignores that people's bodies are different, and some people will be slim no matter what they do, while others are doomed to be heavier regardless what they do on their own (barring extremes like developing eating disorders), but I'm not sure it would matter even should everyone understand that -- a large proportion of people need someone they perceive as lesser whom they can look down upon, and physical appearance is a quick and easy means to categorize others.
That's because people are recommending them for long term use, and treating them like some miracle cure, when the only affect is appetite suppression. If you are malnourished for years, you're just going to die. These things are useful for a few months if you really, really have no willpower and don't want to develop any. For anyone else (most people), it's much healthier to learn how to do difficult things.
Yes, there absolutely is a sense of "it was hard for me, but I did it anyway, you should do the hard thing too". But that's not out of nowhere. Willpower is a muscle. If someone never exercises it, it's going to atrophy. It doesn't need to be shameful, but people who promote these things need to seriously consider the reality that most people's hunger is caused by something real, and just not being hungry does not solve any of those underlying problems.
My mother is a little bit overweight, which is a problem of calories OUT being too low. She doesn't exercise enough. She doesn't have energy to exercise. That's a problem of calories IN being too low. She's taking a GLP-1 now to lose weight. It very exactly does not solve either of those issues. She has less energy. Most of the weight being lost is muscle mass. I think it's despicable that these things were rushed through the medical system. I don't think it's the layman's fault for being manipulated into thinking it's medicine.
There are a few things here. Developing willpower is a thing. Having depression or other mental health issue is another. It is easy to dismiss it as lack of willpower, but it is a bit more complicated.
I also don't think you understand how living with kcal deficiency works on the long run. Have a look at the Minnesota starvation experiment. When in deficit for long the mind constantly goes to "what/when are we going to eat?" and it only gets worse from there. It becomes an obsession. It takes over everything. My understanding is that glp-1 reduces that.
It also helps for people who have too much extra weight, or incapable (waiting for hip replacement, or the elderly) of exercising.
I have been on diet and managed to go back to the target weight (lost around ~16% of bodyweight) but the food noise was real and constant. It is not a one off "I am not going to eat anymore" that was a decision to be made every minute until next meal came around. I do cycle 10-12 hour a week and the occasional footbal game but finding the deficit that is not causing the food noise is different for everyone.
Yeah, no. Willpower is more like a well that replenish with sleep, friends, family and a secure environment and that you use to do anything difficult. The harsher your life, the deeper you need to go to get water back.
I lost now 42 kg from my heaviest (5 kg left to reach my ideal weight of 73 kg), the first 20 i absolutely needed eat less and to fight the hunger pangs (which are more painfull than ankle sprain due to my fucking grehlin receptor being whack), some medical help was needed anyway (i fasted for 5 days under medical supervision to reset my leptin levels, and stayed in ketosis for 3 month prior to that to reset my insulin resistance). 20 kg loss over 18 months. I thought exercise would be enough for the last 20, but i took 5 year to loose 5, and only a change in diet finally helped me go under 80.
NGL, all that is very difficult if you have issues at home or in your life. My family might have individual flaws but as a unit we've been doing great since like 2006, and my income in 2019 when i started my weight loss was comfortable enough for me to have a great apartment, private medial help and a good overall social life.
If people need GLP-1 to get back in track, they should absolutely go for it. I do think we should help them, once they are close to their optimal weight, to sever from GLP1 though, i've heard about the "rebound", imho it is way easier on the mind to eat as much as you use to than forcefully reduce your portions (your leptin/grehlin level were unfucked by GLP1, so your old eating habits are now only psychological, not hormonal)