Comment by qubax

7 years ago

"A commitment to end pay and opportunity inequity"?

I'm confused here. Are they demanding that preferential hiring and advancement practices and programs for women and certain minorities be stopped?

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qubax

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youwishboye  7 years ago

no, they want that next to forced diversity, women and minorities to receive a 20% bonus to their pay

alexis_fr  7 years ago

As you can see, the divide is becoming greater between ones who “believe” and ones who “don’t”, and the audience is massively imposing a bias here in this thread. We’ve lost our ability to listen to each other, and it’s sad that it happened on a topic which is still very easy to judge using science.

  • debacle  7 years ago

    Most reasonable people on HN stay out of these threads. You're not going to change anyone's mind at this point.

    • ergothus  7 years ago

      I think it is true that you wont change most people's minds. (When I discovered the psychological concept of schema, I was literally horrified)

      But some of us are discovering that what we thought of as "normal" (and thus forms the basis of many of of our value judgements) is quite narrow, so we have to adjust our expectations and that changes a lot of things... getting perspectives from others is a necessary and tedious process.

      Im in my early 40s and despite thinking I was pretty liberal on most social issues I've spent the last 10 years discovering I've been wrong, poorly informed, and/or ignorant on a lot of details. At this rate, I dont expect to be done with these self-updates anytime soon, and reasoned arguments and shared experiences, fears, concerns, and hopes are essential for me to re-determine where I now stand, each and every day.

      Just as an example, another comment made an argument about why the market would theoretically prefer underpaid staff. (Which would then not make them underpaid). A good point, but irreconciable with pay gap data...how do I resolve that? Ah, someone replied with a decent response about the issue BEING perceived value. Armed with these positions I can now spend a few minutes of much more effective research, and have better chances of noticing details in my day-to-day life.

      For people who are tired of rehashing the same old arguments with data and answers that are out there for anyone serious to find...it's actually quite hard to find if you dont really know the question, and as unfair as it is, there is a limit to how much time and effort will people will spend grasping at straws about how they themselves might be reinforcing terrible systems. Implicit bias is IMPLICIT and thus it is hard to find out what your biased thoughts are. Effective arguments dramatically reduce that time and effort, and even if most wont take them for that final step, some of us are trying, and are grateful to those that are willing to once again rehash the "obvious" with those that are unlikely to change their minds.

      6 replies →

  • jccalhoun  7 years ago

    >a topic which is still very easy to judge using science

    So how would you do that?

    • alexis_fr  7 years ago

      There is no scientific study about wage gap for equivalent work. If it had been reported properly by newspapers, we wouldn’t be talking about it.