We got here because wealthy ideologues spent half a century creating a biased media ecosystem and attacking the idea that objective truth exists. Calling someone a Nazi because they made a Nazi salute isn’t causative, it’s just recognizing a problem which should have been tackled more aggressively 20 years ago.
Not really. If you're open about it you don't have to hint at it and never say it openly. You know, actually being open about it.
Also, neo-nazis. Not nazis. Nazis were a very real political group. Some are even still alive. None of these teenagers were even born. Their PARENTS weren't even born.
Does that make a difference? Their views check every mark in the description of a Nazi, and they identify themselves as such. If someone walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, in a world where any sane person would do their best to not even appear a duck, they're ducks.
Wasn't one of them reported as saying he was racist before it was cool? The whole problem is that the people around Trump (and even more so Musk) do genuinely appear to have Nazi ish beliefs. This is why their attacks on key parts of the state are making such an impact.
Don't lie to carry the water for Nazis. It empties you of all integrity.
How about blaming the people who are actually acting like Nazis, and also the actual self described Nazis who are supporting them and cheering them on and recruiting off of Musk platforming and promoting them, of emptying the word of all meaning, among other much worse things.
The Nazis are pretty successful to have convinced you to debase yourself by sticking up for them and criticizing anti-fascists for simply calling a spade a spade.
So who do you consider worse: the actual Nazis, or people who you believe are emptying the word Nazi of all meaning (boo hoo hoo)? Because you're siding with and defending the actual Nazis from being called what they are. Is there a word for what that makes you?
BEING nazi/bigot/transphobic/etc is what ATTRACTED every bigot and self admitted Nazi to the Republicans, and there you go, standing up for and defending them by denying reality.
If not yet, then at what point exactly would allow anyone to exercise their own free speech by calling Musk, a self described "free speech absolutist", transphobic? What more would he have to do, than to actually publicly attack and verbally abuse and humiliate and deadname and misgender and lie about his own child?
How about policing the actual Nazis and bigots and transphobes instead of the people like his daughter who rightfully call him what he obviously is by his very own words and deeds?
Elon Musk’s Transgender Daughter Says He Was ‘Cruel’ and ‘Uncaring’:
That was true at one point--I used to make the same objection--but it's 2025 and the threshold has been crossed.
If you wait for unassailable academic applicability, when you finally deploy it your prison guards won't care.
A quick sampling off the top of my head: The First Consigliere throws double Nazi salutes on national TV and smirks in ambiguity when questioned whether he intended it, the President defends a Nazi march as "very fine people", violent private groups serving their political ends have been placed above any (federal) prosecution, and the administration is actively boasting that they will remove undesirables by creating the largest deportation in the entire history of the nation using the same laws abused for the WWII Japanese internment camps.
The label may be rude, but it's not unreasonable... and the more reasonable it is, the better it is to be rude!
I agree with you, but I think it’s important to present facts as facts the best we can. There’s enough terrible things out there both Trump and Musk have said and done, there’s no need to have any shred of mischaracterization.
Is there really any point in being careful with the facts? It seems like the way to win is to convince people of low interest and/or intelligence, which is all about rhetoric and narrativizing anyways. What’s the utility in truth here?
Their boss does nazi salutes at political events. They’re nazis.
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We got here because wealthy ideologues spent half a century creating a biased media ecosystem and attacking the idea that objective truth exists. Calling someone a Nazi because they made a Nazi salute isn’t causative, it’s just recognizing a problem which should have been tackled more aggressively 20 years ago.
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Do you have a video of him looking like a gummy bear?
which word is acceptable to describe the owner of kkk-is-cool.club and n***.rentals?
I think they're pretty open about the nazi stuff at this point.
Not really. If you're open about it you don't have to hint at it and never say it openly. You know, actually being open about it.
Also, neo-nazis. Not nazis. Nazis were a very real political group. Some are even still alive. None of these teenagers were even born. Their PARENTS weren't even born.
If you want to get technical and nuanced about it, that's fine. Neo nazi is a nazi. Punch a nazi. It's good.
This is like arguing that the Republican Party is the one that ended slavery and therefore Republican voters today are not racist.
Does that make a difference? Their views check every mark in the description of a Nazi, and they identify themselves as such. If someone walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, in a world where any sane person would do their best to not even appear a duck, they're ducks.
https://www.npr.org/2025/02/06/nx-s1-5289337/elon-musk-doge-...
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c93q625y04wo
Tell me you really want your personal data in the hands of those people.
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Wasn't one of them reported as saying he was racist before it was cool? The whole problem is that the people around Trump (and even more so Musk) do genuinely appear to have Nazi ish beliefs. This is why their attacks on key parts of the state are making such an impact.
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This isn't what hearsay means.
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Don't lie to carry the water for Nazis. It empties you of all integrity.
How about blaming the people who are actually acting like Nazis, and also the actual self described Nazis who are supporting them and cheering them on and recruiting off of Musk platforming and promoting them, of emptying the word of all meaning, among other much worse things.
The Nazis are pretty successful to have convinced you to debase yourself by sticking up for them and criticizing anti-fascists for simply calling a spade a spade.
So who do you consider worse: the actual Nazis, or people who you believe are emptying the word Nazi of all meaning (boo hoo hoo)? Because you're siding with and defending the actual Nazis from being called what they are. Is there a word for what that makes you?
[flagged]
BEING nazi/bigot/transphobic/etc is what ATTRACTED every bigot and self admitted Nazi to the Republicans, and there you go, standing up for and defending them by denying reality.
If not yet, then at what point exactly would allow anyone to exercise their own free speech by calling Musk, a self described "free speech absolutist", transphobic? What more would he have to do, than to actually publicly attack and verbally abuse and humiliate and deadname and misgender and lie about his own child?
How about policing the actual Nazis and bigots and transphobes instead of the people like his daughter who rightfully call him what he obviously is by his very own words and deeds?
Elon Musk’s Transgender Daughter Says He Was ‘Cruel’ and ‘Uncaring’:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/26/business/media/elon-musk-...
Elon Musk's Daughter Attacks Trump's Order, Addresses 'Nazi Salute':
https://www.newsweek.com/elon-musk-daughter-attacks-trump-ex...
Elon Musk's trans daughter, Vivian Wilson, calls out his Nazi salute: 'Call a spade a spade':
https://www.yahoo.com/news/elon-musks-trans-daughter-vivian-...
Elon Musk’s Trans Daughter Vivian Jenna Wilson Calls Him a “Grubby Little Control Freak”:
https://www.them.us/story/vivian-jenna-wilson-elon-musk-grub...
Elon Musk’s transgender daughter, in first interview, says he berated her for being queer as a child:
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/elon-musk-transgender...
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That was true at one point--I used to make the same objection--but it's 2025 and the threshold has been crossed.
If you wait for unassailable academic applicability, when you finally deploy it your prison guards won't care.
A quick sampling off the top of my head: The First Consigliere throws double Nazi salutes on national TV and smirks in ambiguity when questioned whether he intended it, the President defends a Nazi march as "very fine people", violent private groups serving their political ends have been placed above any (federal) prosecution, and the administration is actively boasting that they will remove undesirables by creating the largest deportation in the entire history of the nation using the same laws abused for the WWII Japanese internment camps.
The label may be rude, but it's not unreasonable... and the more reasonable it is, the better it is to be rude!
I agree with you, but I think it’s important to present facts as facts the best we can. There’s enough terrible things out there both Trump and Musk have said and done, there’s no need to have any shred of mischaracterization.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Is there really any point in being careful with the facts? It seems like the way to win is to convince people of low interest and/or intelligence, which is all about rhetoric and narrativizing anyways. What’s the utility in truth here?
11 replies →