Comment by glimshe
5 days ago
Good riddance. I'd rather have fewer things I care more about. If we rethink our consumption, we could become happier, need less space and spend less money even at higher prices. And when we do need to buy things, we'll be either supporting local workers or friendly nations.
> If we rethink our consumption, we could become happier, need less space and spend less money even at higher prices.
I can't believe how many people are trying to put a positive spin on the government imposing massive taxation on people's right to buy things from other countries.
It's easy to sneer at junk fashion from Temu or whatever, but access to cheap tools and parts was the lifeblood of hobbyists and experimenters across the country.
It's not just cheap clothes from Temu. This administration just took away your right to buy anything cheaply internationally. That's not a good thing.
I think two things can be true at the same time: these taxes are ridiculous, and ordering a 75-cents part from the other side of the planet is a massive waste of resources.
> ordering a 75-cents part from the other side of the planet is a massive waste of resources
Is it really that bad? Is it better to package the part in retail packaging, ship them in bulk to international warehouses, ahead of time, store them for months, then put them in a new package when someone orders them, and mail them through a local postal service.
Versus just stuffing the part in a tiny envelope and sending it directly to the customer? No re-packaging and storage required.
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Yes, and it created an actual problem that (knowingly or not) Trump was responding to - America essentially was getting further and further in debt to enable such high consumption.
I think we'll find that quite a bit of "American Exceptionalism" has been low interest borrowing. I'm not sure to what level, but I think anyone who relies on the S&P 500 as their only investment is going to be disappointed in the future decades of returns.
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You’re correct, but sometimes bad things accidentally have a few good things
So destroying the economy is worth making a few people feel better about minimizing their life? Because that's what is happening. How about people exercise some common sense and not buy things they don't need as opposed to millions of people becoming homeless and military aggression between the USA and China getting much more likely
Some people may feel that their economy was already destroyed when manufacturing was moved to China. Ever drive around Ohio, West Virginia, Indiana, etc? So many dead towns, thanks to jobs moving elsewhere.
I think ending the pipeline of landfill fodder from Temu is a great thing. That kind of consumerism is like eating a diet of pure sugar. Feels good for a second, but bad for the consumer, environment and economy.
I was one of those people who always purchased American when things were being off shored, and I still do as often as I can, especially tools.
Do you know who made the Chinese made goods thing a reality? People from Ohio, West Virginia, Indiana etc. People went into a store, saw the cheaper item, often inferior Chinese item on the shelf and bought it instead of the domestically produced item, even the stuff that said "Designed in America, Made in China". They did this because it was cheaper.
I think you're mistaken if you think some external force "did this to us".
We all do it, some items are just not worth the exuberant price tag, especially if you're only going to use something occasionally.
At least from my observation, the balance was actually not so bad in the last 5 years or so, plenty of good American options available and cheaper Chinese stuff when that was appropriate. I think America will be worse off from this because the cost of so many things will be way higher now, DIY for example will be off the table for a lot of people. The cost of a drill will become ridiculous, for example.
I think ending the pipeline of landfill fodder from Temu is a great thing. That kind of consumerism is like eating a diet of pure sugar. Feels good for a second, but bad for the consumer, environment and economy.
There would've been other ways to go about solving the environmental impacts of Temu than this. In my opinion.
Temu is pure junk, Im glad it’s on its way out. However, im more worried about the economy at a grand scale and with tarrif wars it’s not looking too good for anyone.
Ooof, vote blue vs Temu is a dire state of politics
So throwing society into chaos with a sudden opium ban is worth making a few self righteous officials feel better about controlling everyone's lives? Because that's what this crackdown is bringing. How about people exercise some willpower and moderation with the pipe, instead of driving the entire opium trade underground, creating violence between smugglers, ruining the livelihoods of countless ordinary people caught in the middle, and practically begging the Western powers to escalate their military actions against us when their precious trade is disrupted?
I doubt anyone is seriously arguing the tariffs as implemented are the solution.
On the other hand, if you're thinking all opposition to the tariffs need to agree then you're deluding yourself (not trying to be antagonistic here, but it's dangerous to be blind to alternatives.)
For instance, a smaller tariff on completed Luxury goods and a removal of the Temu exception could've easily been the play and potentially could've been done without much fanfare (by someone who wasn't Trump obviously)
> If we rethink our consumption, we could become happier
If we wished upon a star that humans were better a lot of problems would go away. In the real world, poor people will make do and those with resources will buy smuggled goods. I’m already diverting a spring skiing trip to Canada because it’s cheaper to buy kit there than here.
This is what will happen, it's why Americans and American got into the cheaper, Chinese made goods thing in the first place, there was a LOT of demand for cheaper stuff.
People will just do less, become more poor and have less opportunities or work around the system by smuggling things from Canada or something.
Maybe there was more demand for cheaper stuff in the US because wages had been rather stagnant in relation to production efficiency for decades?
I mean you're entire premise is not great at all. Capitalistic markets require competition to work. The US itself has mostly given up on 'competitive product' competition and instead fight each other with buyouts and other financial funding means.
Kicking China out of the market will just make our goods more expensive and people will do less and become more poor while the investor class gets a little bit richer.
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> we'll be either supporting local workers or friendly nations
Are there any friendly nations left?
God I hope not.
What about buying some largest-in-the-world microcontrollers from Russia?
While I like the joke, Russia is actually making its own original microcontrollers, for example see K1921VG015 (RISC-V 32/50 MHz/1M flash/256K SRAM/square 100-pin package). The $6 price tag seems a little bit expensive to me but well the developers want to eat something too. There are also ARM-based microcontrollers (much more expensive), and of course (even more expensive) famous Elbrus CPUs with unique VLIW architecture.
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so called macrocontrollers, indestructible if Ivan on that day didnt start drinking early morning
>Are there any friendly nations left?
From Trump POV: Ruzzia
Good for you, but it's not all about rabid consumption. My girlfriend has been into jewelry making and ordered a lot of stuff off temu, which she gave away the end product to friends and family. That'll most likely be prohibitively expensive at this point
Temu has notoriously low standards when it comes to jewelry and other jewelry related items. Reddit threads are full of horror stories about toxic materials being used for these items. Be careful what you give out to friends and family.
> Reddit threads are full of horror stories
Reddit is full of horror stories about everything. Mostly because it gets eyeballs. I’m open—almost receptive—to the claim that Temu jewellery contains significant quantities of toxic materials. But we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than Reddit comments.
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She could give cards, food items or hugs. You don't need to cover people in cheap temu stuff to show you love them.
Ah yes, replace a creative hobby with.. hugs
I think you'd be surprised at the quality
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Do tariffs raise the quality of domestic substitutions, or do we simply pay more?
For many products, domestically manufactured substitutes still have some inputs that come from international suppliers.
Could be some raw materials, the machines that make it, or the packaging. Now everything is going to be massively more expensive and it's going to have impacts even on domestically manufactured goods.
There's also the substitution effect, where heavy tariffs on one thing will increase demand on substitutes and therefore raise their prices.
It's really bad policy all around. Nobody who has any familiarity with manufacturing thinks it's going to encourage more domestic manufacturing because the tariffs suddenly restricted your ability to buy inputs and machines at reasonable prices. You're better off building a factory in another country to service global demand.
I have a friend who started a snowboard factory recently, in the USA, he was able to do this because of Chinese made CNC machines and presses that were half the price and had great support.
Now everything he needs from them to keep his factory going is going to be ridiculously more expensive, probably screwing over his business as well.
This factory wouldn't have got off the ground if it wasn't for Chinese made machines.
Tariffs lower the quality and increase the prices of domestic substitutes. There is no competition. Tariffs are how business is done in third-world countries like India. Production of everything is banned/controlled, except for the few buddies of the government in power.
Either you will pay more for domestic producers or (more likely) you will not pay at all since either domestic production will not ramp up for niche things, or you will not be willing to pay hikes domestic prices for the same utility.
lower quality, higher price.
You were always free to buy fewer things you care more about.
This isn’t true, because the subsidized stuff from China drove medium-quality choices out of the market.
Try to buy some nicer jeans or T-shirts. The choices are stuff made as cheaply as possible, brand name stuff made as cheaply as possible but marked up like it isn’t, and actual quality clothes at 15x the price of the cheapest stuff. Most of the US clothing manufacturers have pivoted to the high-end just to survive or moved production overseas and are coasting along on their brand reputation.
Try buying a decent toaster, I've found exactly the same. $20, $30, and $50 options all using the same internal mechanism with a different style of shell and minor changes to the control circuit, or $200-$1k models that are mostly marketed for commercial kitchens/hospitality use. Not a whole lot in between.
>The choices are stuff made as cheaply as possible, brand name stuff made as cheaply as possible but marked up like it isn’t
How are the tariffs going to change this? The incentive for the US clothing manufacturers now is to offer the lowest quality possible, at a similar but slightly lower prices than the tariffed prices.
but they are not giving them time to rethink ...
I agree. There should be a global blockade of the USA to return the standard of living to the stone age. Why stop at tariffs?
Well, from outside it seems that the list of friendly nations keep getting smaller and smaller… and good luck replacing the vast majority of your supply chain with local workers. Just look where all the products you currently have were made.