Comment by cardanome
20 hours ago
It is normal to struggle with procrastination from time to time but if is a regular occurrence you need to check the actual causes.
You might have ADHD.
And is is very important to know whether you have it or not because all that advice for neurotypical people will not work for you then. In fact it will harm you. It will make you feel as a failure.
You need to figure out how your brain works and only then you will finally manage to make lasting changes.
I would argue the other way around. I have ADHD, but the thing that really helped me with work procrastination, which I think would help even without ADHD, was to find a job that is actually interesting.
In approx 7 years I went through working at all the top software companies in my country, but what really fixed my problems was moving on to being a researcher at the university. I’m now paid less than half from before, but it’s still enough, and I couldn’t be happier.
Getting to work on what I think is actually important and interesting every day is what helped. I also seem happier than the younger researchers who didn’t work at companies first, who don’t know how good they have it.
What’s an example of the kind of advice that doesn’t work?
(I’m always curious to learn other potential diagnostic markers for adhd)
>What’s an example of the kind of advice that doesn’t work?
For some people struggling with chronic lifelong procrastination, the oft-repeated advice from the author such as "Action leads to motivation, not the other way around." ... and similar variants such as, "Screw motivation, what you need is discipline!" ... and other related big picture ideas such as Dilbert cartoonist Scott Adams' "Systems instead of Goals" -- all do not work.
And adding extra rhetorical embellishments to the advice such as using the phrase "it's simple [...]", and using the word "[...] just [...]" as in:
- "Stopping procrastination isn't that hard to solve. It's simple. Just chop up the task into much smaller subtasks and just start on that tiny subtask. That will give you momentum to finish it."
... also doesn't work. Some procrastinators just procrastinate the initiation of starting that tiny subtask! For the few that actually do try to start with that first step, they'll quickly lose steam because of boredom/distraction/whatever and the overall task remains unfinished.
A lot of books and blogs about time management repeat the same advice that many procrastinators have all heard before and it doesn't work. The procrastinators understand the logic of the advice but it doesn't matter because there are psychological roadblocks that prevent them from following it.
EDIT reply to: >That doesn't mean the advice is bad,
I'm not saying the advice is wrong. Instead, I'm saying that some well-meaning people who give that repeated advice seem surprised that it doesn't work on some people. Because the advice givers believed "Action Precedes Motivation" worked on themselves, they automatically assume that imparting those same words to other procrastinators will also work. It often doesn't. The meta-analysis of that advice and why it sometimes doesn't work is not done because the people giving that advice are the ones who used that technique successfully. This creates a self-confirmation bias.
If somebody had “lifelong procrastination” and was routinely overwhelmed by simple tasks, my first thought would be to see if they are actually dealing with depression because it sounds like something bigger.
3 replies →
Your points are well taken, though I want to nuance them a bit. My experience(with severe ADHD-C) is that this type of advice can work. It's just that it's not something you can just decide to start doing and immediately find success at. It's just a lot more complicated to get this off the ground, but it's possible. For some complex organisational system, you need to compile that system into "ADHD byte code" and for that, you need to bootstrap a compiler. Create an incredibly simple, extensible system which can do things your ADHD brain can't on its own. Then you need to find ways to force yourself to follow that system using various hacks like alarms tied to QR codes, body doubling, regular therapy or home visits, etc. then you can start implementing more complex structure in that system. And even the simple system is not gonna be easy. It's gonna take months of trying, failing, starting over. The ADHD brain is absolutely capable of developing habits(just look at the comorbidity rates between ADHD and various types of addiction), it's just a lot of work.
I'm in the process of doing this myself, and after 8 months, with many setbacks, I kinda have a base system I'm following that's significantly improving my quality of life and ability to keep up with everyday tasks. And it's still a struggle, but it's getting easier.
I'm writing a blog post about it currently, which will be more structured. It's about how I used my software dev skills to think about and tackle my ADHD(and other issues). Not about writing actual software(although software is involved), but imagining the brain exhibiting ADHD is a software system , identifying the "bugs", and combining concepts from software dev and behavioral/cognitive psychology to fix, or at least mitigate them.
This blog post could be finished two days from now, two years from now, or never. ADHD is still hard to live with, and I'm still quite dysfunctional. I guess if I do finish it, it'll be worth reading since I'll be on to something...
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so what does work then?
isn't the problem here that the answer is very individual. for me for example some of the above things do work, and some don't. some of the time. it's like it depends and there is no clear answer even just for myself. knowing whether i had ADHD would not make any difference. i'd still not know what works.
for example i have seen tasks lists recommended as one way to deal with ADHD. because the lists help focus. isn't breaking things down into small steps the same thing? others here with ADHD also claim that specific suggestions work for them. so this isn't clear cut, and it doesn't make sense to just dismiss the suggestions.
you are right, there is more than just getting started. boredom and distractions are a problem too. but they are also a problem for "normal" people.
seems to me that the only thing we can do is to list a number of possible approaches, and let everyone pick what works best for them.
so back to the original question: what does work for people with ADHD?
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This looks like an answer from a procrastinator that actually developed a system to ensure they continue procrastinating long-term. Sure, suggestions of systems that could help with that won't help without a sometimes descomunal effort. That doesn't mean the advice is bad, just that it's hard and most people won't be able to overcome lifelong procrastination.
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ADHD is so stigmatized now that you cannot with a straight face tell someone "I have ADD" without getting an eye roll, unfortunately. many won't believe you were correctly diagnosed
I've also found that there's no real cure for it. You can take the meds but they'll chip away at your personality and health in other ways.
I used to think that being diagnosed would not change much but for me it did. A lot. Just having more knowledge about myself has been extremely empowering. Even just knowing myself that I have it helps me be kinder to myself.
Also there is ADHD coaching. Having someone who had ADHD themselves coach me through my problems was an absolute game changer.
Maybe that could be an option for you as well. Worked much better that traditional therapy for me personally.
As for medication, well for most people with ADHD it works really well and is worth the relative mild side effect. But that is most, for some it does not work unfortunately. I think it is always worth trying but yeah it is no silver bullet that works for everyone.