Comment by VikingMiner

4 days ago

> In reality, this wouldn’t happen, because, generally, people understand that stabbings are a cultural issue, rather than a technical one

Many UK MPs don't understand this. I've heard of MPs making (moronic) suggestions such as selling kitchen knives without the point on it. I've literally seen this advertised as a solution on the news.

For whatever reason they don't seem to understand that literally anyone can make a shiv.

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VikingMiner

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arp242  4 days ago

"We believe that paedophiles are using an area of internet the size of Ireland, and through this they can control keyboards." – Syd Rapson MP in 2001.

But really, with 650 MPs there's bound to be a few that are a bit silly at least some of the time. You can hear some wild takes at the local pub too (or nextdoor), but that doesn't mean everyone in your area is a moron.

  • VikingMiner  4 days ago

    I too have watched Brass Eye, and they literally had MPs telling people about the dangers of "cake" in a previous episode. It showed that MPs and TV celebrities would literally say anything Anchorman style if it was put on a teleprompter / script in front of them. They are nothing other than paid actors.

    While I don't believe everyone in Parliament is a moron. I think more than enough of them are moronic, out of touch, malicious or home combination of the three for it to be a problem.

    Generally the only solution presented for any issue in the UK is banning something. There is no other course of action that they can envisage. So you end up in a false dichotomy, discussing whether something should be banned or not. There is no discussion why the issue is happening in the first place, only whether <thing> should be banned or not.

    • arp242  3 days ago

      Some journalist shows up with a somewhat implausible story and can tell any lie to convince you it's real. I can see how an MP might fall for it, and it's a mistake to think you're somehow above that. We also don't see any of the false positives; did they go "MP shopping" and we only saw the ones that did fall for it?

tzs  3 days ago

I would love it if my steak knives did not have a point. Never once have I needed to stab my steak. The only thing I’ve ever stabbed with them is myself by accident.

exasperaited  4 days ago

> I've heard of MPs making (moronic) suggestions such as selling kitchen knives without the point on it. I've literally seen this advertised as a solution on the news.

As someone who is clumsy and easily distracted, I have such a kitchen knife. They are commonly available. It works absolutely fine and it has three times minimised an injury that would have been nasty because I am an easily-distracted tired old idiot.

The point of a knife is only needed in a handful of kitchen applications. Most knives do not need to be able to stab at all. Only cut.

And combined with rules on the sales of longer blades that do have a point, this idea could genuinely be part of reducing knife crime (especially among the very youngest).

Because it does reduce access to knives that would be useful for stabbing, and it reduces the severity of injuries caused by the youngest in knife crime incidents. Without meaningfully affecting the kitchen usefulness of most small blades at all.

If I go to a supermarket and buy a long enough knife with a point on it, in theory I am asked to prove my age (in practice they laugh at the idea that I might not be young enough). The same is true for many (not all) products on Amazon, in fact.

The knife without a point on it did not trigger age verification. Nor does a boxcutter type thing, in practice; only retractible blades that don't snap off are on the list, AFAIK. (And only flick-knife-type mechanisms are banned).

I anticipate being downvoted for simply writing about this, but harm reduction through knife sales controls is not something that just stupid MPs think: it is supported by expert opinion.

Knife crime in the UK is a problem. It is still not a problem as severe per-capita as it is elsewhere, but we are trying measures to dissuade it.

Behaviour modification is not always stupid or evil; cultures do it all the time.

  • AngryData  4 days ago

    A tipless knife may prevent accidents, but if you purposefully tried to stab yourself or someone else with one of those knives, do you honestly believe it wouldn't tear right through your flesh? Neither my butter knives or bread knives have tips, and yet I could easily stab people with them.

  • danaris  4 days ago

    > The point of a knife is only needed in a handful of kitchen applications. Most knives do not need to be able to stab at all. Only cut.

    But this isn't about what "most knives" need to be able to do.

    This is about what everyone in the UK will be permitted to buy.

    "I don't need to do X often, so why should I worry about it?" is a really, really bad attitude to take when your government is considering banning X for the entire country.

    • exasperaited  4 days ago

      No, it's not. At all!

      It's about what everyone not old enough will be permitted to buy.

      Nobody is saying that pointed knives shouldn't be sold; they are saying two things:

      1) children shouldn't be able to buy them (they can't)

      2) behaviour modification might suggest that fewer such knives even have to be made, because they aren't as important as they seem, and that might keep more convenient knives out of the hands of very young misguided children

      The law has created a situation where I as an adult can:

      1) buy a pointed knife if it looks like I am an adult (or it doesn't and I can prove I am)

      2) buy a non-pointed knife without proving it.

      This seems acceptable to me. I expect to be downvoted without a meaningful reply for saying so, because that is the way of things here.

      I appreciate your policing my attitude but I don't know where you get the complete nonsense that the government is considering banning X for the entire country for this X or any other. Because they are not.

      We in Europe try not to assume that Marjorie Taylor-Greene speaks for all Americans. There are 650 MPs in the UK Parliament, and some of them are silly or misinformed. One or two are as stupid as she is. Try to take that in.