Comment by RyJones

3 months ago

I've been to Kyiv five times to deliver aid via help99.co, and I've spent many, many hours with Europeans driving trucks from Tallinn to Kyiv.

The people volunteering and driving know Europe is at war. They all say nobody else where they live realizes this.

It's frustrating.

24 comments

RyJones

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lan321  3 months ago

In my eyes it's more so that we don't care in that sense. My friend group is mostly just keeping in mind that they might have to dip to another country/continent at some point, maybe, unlikely though.

I'm pretty sure everyone I know would rather get imprisoned than go die in the mud to protect property they don't own, on the orders of a government that doesn't care about the same things they care about.

When we talk about it, it always boils down to a discussion on how to best desert/escape at different stages.

  • overfeed  3 months ago

    If the relationship with America deteriorates, which countries do you think will accept European refugees? Your friends may have to stay and fight not out of patriotism, but necessity. In a total-war scenario, even prisoners will find themselves contributing to thr war effort.

    • lukan  3 months ago

      Since europeans are quite wealthy, many will be happy to accept them (as long as they still have money and qualifications).

      But leaving all moral questions aside, where to go?

      South america might turn into a war zone as well. Africa partly is already. Asia similar.

      New Zealand sounds good, but even Peter Thiel found out, that money will get you only so far in buying a safe haven.

      So personally I would opt for fixing the problems in europe. And am on it within my abilities. But .. with limits. I do not trust my politicians either and I am multilingual and traveled the world a lot. So in the end I would also rather take my family and leave, then being ordered to go fight in a war with half working equipment, because corruption and proud incompetence prevented preparation. (Many in the german military for instance hold the opinion, that they don't need to learn from the incompetent ukrainians, because they are all fighting wrong)

      4 replies →

    • lan321  2 months ago

      We all have relatives all over the place, many have multiple passports/citizenships, most are well educated and/or make good money, most speak 3+ languages.. It'll work out. Countries take in refugees with much different cultures and lower education in the hopes of adding to their workforce. Someone will gladly take us.

      I'm guessing in the worst case South America/AU/NZ/JP/UAE/Canada would be the goals.

      The only real risk I see is essentially waiting too long and getting detained right as they begin to close off the borders for people of fighting age.

brabel  3 months ago

We are not at war. No bombs are falling in our cities. Our children are not being drafted and coming back in coffins. No one is bombing our ships and railways, so we have plenty of food on the table. If you think we are at war you have no idea what you’re talking about.

NooneAtAll3  3 months ago

EU got itself a Cuba

too bad that Cuba is right on its own border :)

  • embedding-shape  3 months ago

    So literally just like Cuba? The distance between US and Cuba is like 150km, if you're in Donetsk you can't even leave Donetsk Oblast if you travel 150km, and the shortest distance you can take from Ukraine<>Russia to closest EU/NATO member would be something like 600km if you don't take shortcuts via Belarus.

    For all intents and purposes, Ukraine's border with Russia is way further away (like magnitude) from EU/NATO than US<>Russia (who are neighbors) or US<>Cuba (who are also neighbors).