Comment by mcny
3 days ago
Maybe I am thinking about this the wrong way so please correct me if I am wrong.
1. The civilian planes fly on pre published routes and communicate with air traffic controllers in plain text
1. Any covert military operation has access to these plans
1. I understand that there may be reasons why military planes might want to fly undetected but given they know where the civilian planes are and where they are flying, it should be trivial for the military ships and planes to avoid those areas.
> 1. The civilian planes fly on pre published routes and communicate with air traffic controllers in plain text
That's called a flight plan. It's just a declaration of intent, so that the ATCs know that you're expected. There are many valid reasons for deviating from the flight plan. For example, technical difficulties, bad weather, last minute diversions etc. That makes it very unreliable to predict the aircraft's location. You have to rely on your radar instead. The Military has some of the best radars around - especially on AEW&CS aircrafts and ships that stay close to conflict zones at all times.
> 1. I understand that there may be reasons why military planes might want to fly undetected but given they know where the civilian planes are and where they are flying, it should be trivial for the military ships and planes to avoid those areas.
Did you know that the Ronald Reagan Intl airport (DCA) saw one 'close call' between a civilian airliner and a military helicopter every month for the 13 year period from 2011 to 2024? [1]. That's close to 150 near disasters in total, for consecutive months for more than a decade! This is ridiculous!
Clearly, it's not a question if they can stay clear to avoid an incident. It's a question of if anyone cares at all.
[1] https://www.npr.org/2025/03/11/nx-s1-5324543/ntsb-dca-mid-ai...
If they deviate from their flight plan, don't they have to at least inform ATC to basically update the flight plan? I vaguely recall this from my PPL training about 20 years ago (I haven't been current for a long time) but I also never had to fly over international waters where I'd imagine you can't radio anyone so I don't know that that works.
> If they deviate from their flight plan, don't they have to at least inform ATC to basically update the flight plan
When on an IFR flight plan - at least domestically, especially in busy airspaces, the flight plan is mainly sort of a backup in case of lost-comms. You are typically vectored by ATC and your route may or may not be exactly what you filed. For example, in the SoCal area, the "standard" IFR routes can be pretty roundabout going around the approach/departure corridors of the main airports. But, if at any time the area is clear, ATC would typically clear you through a shorter routing.
I am not sure how it works for international routes. I know that for trans-oceanic routing, they typically make position reports over HF radio when over the ocean where there is no ADSB coverage.
The pilots have ipads and internet connections... can't they just have it check e.g. flightaware or similar tool for nearby aircraft and keep them alerted if something is getting too close?
Yes, that's called ADS-B. It's a huge improvement in avoiding collisions. But both planes need to be transmitting their location and vectors.
The military plane was running silent.
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