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Comment by yoyohello13

5 days ago

Are we not there yet?

US real median household income has been steadily rising[1] for the last 40+ years. Life expectancy is rising again after dipping and plateauing for a few years. Employment numbers are pretty good given the macro headwinds. The US forms ~5.9 million new businesses per year which vastly out paces the EU.

The US isn't without problems, but we're doing OK.

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N

It's incredible that not a single person replying negatively has included a single piece of data.

  • > US real median household income has been steadily rising[1] for the last 40+ years.

    Compare it to the Consumer Price Index:

    https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CUUR0000SA0R

    • I think CPI is a poor measure, because it's a moving meter stick that understates inflation. When beef is overpriced, hamburger switches into the basket. When hamburger is a luxury, then chicken swaps into it instead. It understates inflation.

      M2 change is a much better measure in my opinion. Using M2 is literally comparing supply of item to supply of cash which could immediately buy it. When scaling SPX or GC1! by M2SL[0]/M2SL, you get a surprisingly flat time series over decades, which reads to me that the effects of the change in M2 are being filtered out of an otherwise exponential price curve.

  • More people outside employment than COVID or Great Recession. Inflation wiping out income growth. Family units replaced by multi-job slavery shows up as “improved GDP”. There’s the powerball lottery that one person wins every few weeks and then there’s the crippling medical debt lottery that many people are “winning” every day. Wake up.

    • > Inflation wiping out income growth

      Real income means inflation adjusted, so we actually see the median income outpacing inflation right now.

      > More people outside employment than COVID or Great Recession

      There's a lot going on here. One factor is that many people retired early during the pandemic and are going to skew this stat. It's also worth pointing out that the labor force participation rate is ~62% and peaked historically at 67%, so it's not that far off.

      > Are you ignorant or propaganda peddler

      This is needlessly inflammatory.

      9 replies →

  • But I think there will be a lag. The US has (willingly) forfeited some of its soft power and we may not see the impact of that immediately.

    • No argument there. The US has been hit hard by the global populist political wave in recent years.

  • So many of my people in the US can't even make ends meet anymore that I opened a dedicated line of budget to provide help where I can. It's never been that bad before and it's nowhere near as bad for my people in the EU (not that everything is all rosy there, mind you).

    You might argue that Americans are just less capable of supporting themselves but I reject that argument firmly. The situation really reads like systemic causes. And I think cherry picking numbers to convince ourselves otherwise does more harm than good.

  • >Life expectancy is rising again after dipping and plateauing for a few years

    Life expectancy dipping for any develop country, even if temporary, is an embarrassing catastrophe.

    • Well there was a global pandemic the prematurely killed a lot of elderly people, and the dip happened in a lot of countries.

  • Maybe break down those numbers by income and you'll see that rich people are doing fine, everyone else not so much.

    • Incomes at the lowest quintile rose 47% from 2021 to 2024. That growth slowed in 2025, but outpaced the growth of higher income quintiles in the first few years post pandemic. Real median household income in 2024 was $83,730 which is the highest it has ever been, and that is the middle quintile.

      4 replies →

  • M2 outstrips it.

    My favorite way to gauge historical prices/data is to scale it with M2:

    (TradingView): M2SL[0]/M2SL*TICKER

    Replace M2SL[0] with the latest M2 value. 23.05 T should be 23.05*10^12.

    Compare SPX, GC1!, SI1!, CL1!, or any other TICKER you can think of!

    Another cool little model I like to look at which starkly shows the loss of power for us little guys:

    (TradingView): 23.05*10^12/M2SL*A4102C1Q027SBEA/(USPOP*CIVPART/100)

    Basically in 1960 the average worker earned 3x the purchasing power from their wages compared to today.

    TL;DR: Ron Paul was right!