Comment by sccvcxv
2 days ago
It should be illegal to ask for references - the purpose of the interview is to understand your capabilities and abilities. If they couldn't suss all about you in that process then they have a shitty interview process.
2 days ago
It should be illegal to ask for references - the purpose of the interview is to understand your capabilities and abilities. If they couldn't suss all about you in that process then they have a shitty interview process.
It's a data point, not a final or primary determinant.
Vast majority of corporate team members or leads are not allowed to say anything bad or much other than whether that person was employed or not.
Nevertheless :
1. If a person has a comprehensive long resume but cannot provide meaningful references, that poses a significant question as to why
2. A person will not typically say anything bad about their ex colleague or team members due to legal and policy constraints. Nevertheless if they stick to the "this person was employed here" and don't give even a perfunctory "oh Bob? Yeah he was a good guy. He was employed here from 2023 to 2025" even after some soft prompting, again, a data point.
Depends what you're looking for in an employee or colleague. If "history of not completely burning bridges to the ground " is relevant to you, references are "a" data point.
It kinda sucks though if you end up being a bad culture fit a couple times in a row. You end up being rejected on that basis alone. Forever. And there is nothing you can do about it, even of you are qualified for the jobs you apply for.
If you can't get three people to vouch for you, honestly or otherwise, then that's a pretty big red flag.
It's usually last manager and co-workers where the company has a policy of not allowing references. Plus who wants to bother other people asking for a reference after you've been working for 25 years.
I have never heard of not allowing references. Is that a US thing?
While I don't love providing references, given they are such a standard part of the employment process (at least here in Australia), I can't see how a company could disallow providing character references. That would be a big red flag if I discovered that after starting to work somewhere.
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The big issue is that a lot of companies don’t allow asking their employees for references. Many even require references for their own hiring process (!!!)
Can you elaborate?
Many companies don't allow details, but are allowed to confirm a person was employed in a specific role. That's in many cases a sufficient to serve as a reference.
E.g. In my company we have a very strict policy for this, but are still allowed to answer "yes, Bob was employed as problem manager team lead from 2023 to 2025". Conversely as a hiring manager, I'll take that as a minimally sufficient data point in confirming resume entry.
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I big red flag for what? your social habits? lol - i guess if you have to work in a team then yeah, that would be important. but some jobs you just need to get in the truck and drive or w/e, but recruiters still stuck in the time old habit of asking for 3 references. its weak.
I imagine even in such a job, your shift lead, team boss, or warehouse manager or whatever, would be able to confirm "yes, Bob worked here in truck driving capacity from 2022 to 2024".
References have many levels of usefulness, but the bar starts low - did this person actually perform the job / hold the role they claim in a resume.
Next, and the one I'll agree you don't get as much in modern environment, is how much did they burn bridges / how competent they were. The team boss might be allowed to say "Bob?!? He drove well but god dammit the guy never showed up on time for his shift!". Or they might not.
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A truck driver has to deal with a lot of people at the two ends of the trip and needs to work in a team.
> purpose of the interview is to understand your capabilities and abilities
And the purpose of the reference is to understand your actual performance.
If you’re lazy or cruel to coworkers, they won’t want to hire you.
Mixed. I disagree because you can't get culture fit out of a few hours of interviews, so having people who worked with you can help a lot.
I primarily agree because some companies get way too haughty and try to ask for references in the job app. There's no way I'm giving contact info of my leadership to you to bother them (2 of which very carefully avoid posting their contact info on the internet) unless I'm dead sure I'm in consideration for a role. Certainly not before I can talk to a human.
You sound like someone that is frequently calling in sick!
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At least my experience in the professional world, if the provided reference says anything negative about the interviewee it’s a massive red flag.
Maybe you don’t think that way, but for every position I have ever posted you’ll get at least 100 applicants, and each of them take a massive amount of time to interview and get through the system to hire.
That reference is one more thing that helps. Better yet, it’s great when someone knows someone that you do, because then it’s easy to vouch for them.
Like when it comes to dating, are you going to date a random person that you know nothing about, or go out on a date that your best friend recommends who knows you?
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I assume your references would state that you're an unhinged lunatic?
That is true. Then again if you can’t even provide a reference you’re unable to jump a very low bar.
We’re inundated with fake applicants. References are more than mandatory now. But not enough, the whole system is broken.
Also you come off like a reactionary ahole.