Comment by zephen
16 days ago
> The notion of “your work is too similar to mine so I get to take ownership of it from you”
That notion only applies to patents and trademarks, and it seems highly unlikely that it would ever directly apply to copyright.
It may seem like the notion applies to copyrights, but it really doesn't. Independent creation is, and has always been, a solid defense to claims of copyright infringement.
That is why, when Phoenix Technologies reverse-engineered the IBM PC BIOS, they had two teams -- a team that took apart the original and documented the functional features (which have never been copyrightable) and a second team which took the description of the functional features and wrote new code.
The issue with songwriters has always been that, for civil laws, it's hard to prove a negative. How can you prove you never heard that song? Especially when it got a lot of radio airtime.
Now, how do you prove that your AI didn't ingest copyrighted code and then regurgitate it. Obviously, you can't.
> if AI is the instrument of that invention's demise, then I look forward to it.
Any court ruling that you would find beneficial for code copyright would mean that a human could have two windows open on their computer and cut and paste from one to the other and claim independent invention. That seems unlikely to be a good result, and also seems unlikely to come to pass.
> That notion only applies to patents and trademarks
You literally just gave an example above of that notion applying to copyright. There's no mere “seem like” at play here: the litigious music IP owners suing the pants off of musicians know full well that precisely zero musicians (least of all commercial ones) exist in a vacuum, and that's indeed the basis for the success of their litigiousness. Even if you can somehow prove you've never heard a particular song, You Live In A Society™ and that existing intellectual property's influence on society in turn influences subsequent creators.
There is, in other words, no such thing as true “independent creation”.
> Any court ruling that you would find beneficial for code copyright would mean that a human could have two windows open on their computer and cut and paste from one to the other and claim independent invention.
Don't threaten me with a good time :)
> You literally just gave an example above of that notion applying to copyright.
No, I literally did not. The difference may be subtle, but it is real, as I explained.
> Even if you can somehow prove you've never heard a particular song, You Live In A Society™ and that existing intellectual property's influence on society in turn influences subsequent creators.
And many musicians have won copyright cases, because their shit wasn't similar enough.
> There is, in other words, no such thing as true “independent creation”.
Which is why the whole enterprise is heavily fact-based. Seriously, think about it. If copyright is to have any teeth at all, then there has to be some line that can be crossed.
> Don't threaten me with a good time :)
Ah, I see where you're coming from. Well, I hate to break it to you, but the chances of AI eviscerating either copyright or patent laws are approximately nil.
> And many musicians have won copyright cases, because their shit wasn't similar enough.
And many musicians have lost copyright cases, because — per my point — their shit was similar enough by complete accident, because
1. We Live In A Society™ and therefore are constantly exposed to all sorts of things we don't consciously remember 5 minutes later but which stick around subconsciously, lurking for your next “Eureka!” moment; and
2. Musical genres (especially the mainstream ones) tend to coalesce on rather limited sets of chord progressions and rhythms and such, so it becomes more and more difficult to write songs that fit within that genre without accidentally “plagiarizing” some other existing song in that genre (or a related one).
3 replies →