Comment by qarl
10 hours ago
They state replacing backprop is not their goal.
Their goal is to understand how distributed systems which cannot do backprop (the brain) can still do learning.
10 hours ago
They state replacing backprop is not their goal.
Their goal is to understand how distributed systems which cannot do backprop (the brain) can still do learning.
"Backprop alternative" was the OP's headline.
I think my initial assessment is correct: interesting research, but not an alternative, at least not yet.
Personally I think the dirty secret of the brain is that a lot of things are hard coded. And many things that we need to learn are also hard coded except that some parameters need to be tuned.
If we puke, the brain will not do general aversive learning, it will learn to avoid specifically the last thing eaten, because it instinctively knows about food poisoning.
Imprinting is absolutely fascinating. Some newborn animals will run a very simple pattern detector like looking for a red dot or something and use that to bootstrap their conception of their parent.
For fully general learning I have a hunch that it can be done using local history plus a semi-global reward scalar (global neurotransmittor levels).
regardless if the intelligence in the brain is hardcoded or not, to the extent it is, this information must have been compressed in the genome, which runs counter to almost all observations: a child doesn't remember the experience of their ancestors, for example. The only sense in which we do carry mental state without relearning is emotions, instincts, reflexes (some neuronal pathways that connect the eye to the middle ear), hormonal driven behavior (fear adrenalin).
For another, there are about 200k promotor regions (including non-coding) in the human genome.
A promotor region might have say 6 to 15 bits of information.
Can you compress 2025 or even 2024 era LLM intelligence into 3 megabit = ~400 kB ? I think not. I think a lot of compression is still possible, but 400 kB?
So I think we can box up the idea of "dirty secrets of the braing: not learning but hard coding". There is a lot of hard coding in biology, but brains are evolved specifically to enable learning within the individual lifetime instead of only learning by natural selection.
I also don't buy the following argument:
> If we puke, the brain will not do general aversive learning, it will learn to avoid specifically the last thing eaten, because it instinctively knows about food poisoning.
Each time it happens that I end up puking, I do feel aversion and try to avoid puking at all, sometimes I succeed but sometimes is just puke. There must be fundamental puke reflexes (which one fails to avoid) and avertable puke reflexes.
> Can you compress 2025 or even 2024 era LLM intelligence into 3 megabit = ~400 kB ? I think not. I think a lot of compression is still possible, but 400 kB?
There are a few extra levels of interpretation (like protein synthesis) that are more like a transpiler than compression (imo), over a 4-base language that is read in a sliding window and is affected by surrounding conditions, so the same "token" sequence may produce different things depending on external factors. Some biologists I used to collaborate with talked about 7 layers to this process, I have only described one level here
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