Comment by gjm11

4 days ago

I'll attempt to be brief.

If you think it's likely that there will be a singularity and it will be bad, then you'll regard someone working toward it as bad. That doesn't mean that there's any good-versus-evil-ness about the singularity itself. Whereas Armageddon is specifically a battle of good against evil, the Last Judgement is specifically a separation of people into (something like) good versus evil, etc.

The "betrayal" line is saying that OpenAI was founded as, supposedly, an ethical company trying to make sure that AI worked out for the good of humanity, and Altman is failing to live up to that. It doesn't have anything to do with any high view of Altman personally.

I agree that that line is more positive about both Musk and Zuckerberg than either deserves. But the claim wasn't "some rationalists think too highly of tech CEOs", it was "rationalists think about tech CEOs like religious people think about their high priests", and the point is that nothing I've found suggests that that's so. Sometimes people say nice things about (say) Mark Zuckerberg, sometimes not so nice (there was one comment where someone suggested that a different approach to AI safety might have resulted in "Mark Zuckerberg stamping on a face for ever") but no more of it than in the world at large is looking reverently to them as authorities.

If you're happy also saying that computer science and academia in general are religions, then fair enough, but at this point I think saying "X is a religion" is no longer really saying anything.

I don't know whether you're right or wrong in saying that rationalists are too unwilling to accept arguments that are logically invalid but persuasive in other ways, but this seems a long way from saying that logical fallacies are to rationalists as heresies are to (say) Christians.

> but this seems a long way from saying that logical fallacies are to rationalists as heresies are to (say) Christians.

Logical fallacies do nothing to show an argument is wrong.

All they do is demonstrate that a chain of reasoning cannot be a logical proof that the conclusion must be true, given its premises.

Dismissing arguments because "they're fallacious" is actually not so far removed from dismissing ideas because they're heretical.

In each case, what matters is whether the ideas are true, not whether your interlocutor proved rigorously it is true.