> These are companies that use hundreds of thousands of stolen credit cards to sign up for fake accounts.
You claim VISA and other credit card companies don't mind if merchants like DeepSeek steal hundreds of thousands of credit cards and use them? And still continue to give them merchant accounts to continue with that?
Isn't it more likely that some people are scaremongering?
Of course credit card companies mind? It's not a problem they can magically solve just because they mind, though. Credit card fraud on massive scale has existed for years and is not going away anytime soon.
> And still continue to give them merchant accounts to continue with that?
The AI companies don't steal the credit cards. They instead fund unaffiliated grey-market transfer stations that steal credit cards. They feign compliance by simply funding another transfer station.
Those companies thought they were interacting only with an entity in a country they trust, and instead had their data sent to a country they don't. If I'm sending you my data I'd like to know beforehand if it's being relayed to another country.
What an absurd question. We have actual evidence of DeepSeek using stolen credit cards and routing conversations to third parties. What evidence do we have of OpenAI or Anthropic doing something similar?
"Anthropic/OpenAI bad!" cynicism is not a replacement for critical thinking (as it increasingly seems to be on HN).
What evidence? You didn't link any. Searching for the hints in your comments brings up marketing by Anthropic "data you sent to one company is being sent to another without your knowledge or consent!" Anthropic also states this without any evidence, but I'm not suggesting it's not true!
I am so glad we never see stories against Anthropic/OpenAI claiming that! Thankfully we don't even have to search, critical thinking is enough to know that Anthropic/OpenAI are responsible data sovereign and others are not.
Yes, routing your customers through relays is probably illegal and certainly violates any expectation a business using your API might have.
I don't think that X post from someone that sells relays is meaningful. Obviously Anthropic is aware of what relays are, they aren't dumb enough to conflate relays with DeepSeek.
> These are companies that use hundreds of thousands of stolen credit cards to sign up for fake accounts.
You claim VISA and other credit card companies don't mind if merchants like DeepSeek steal hundreds of thousands of credit cards and use them? And still continue to give them merchant accounts to continue with that?
Isn't it more likely that some people are scaremongering?
Of course credit card companies mind? It's not a problem they can magically solve just because they mind, though. Credit card fraud on massive scale has existed for years and is not going away anytime soon.
> And still continue to give them merchant accounts to continue with that?
The AI companies don't steal the credit cards. They instead fund unaffiliated grey-market transfer stations that steal credit cards. They feign compliance by simply funding another transfer station.
Because OpenAI and Anthropic are so virtuous and trustworthy?
Those companies thought they were interacting only with an entity in a country they trust, and instead had their data sent to a country they don't. If I'm sending you my data I'd like to know beforehand if it's being relayed to another country.
What an absurd question. We have actual evidence of DeepSeek using stolen credit cards and routing conversations to third parties. What evidence do we have of OpenAI or Anthropic doing something similar?
"Anthropic/OpenAI bad!" cynicism is not a replacement for critical thinking (as it increasingly seems to be on HN).
What evidence? You didn't link any. Searching for the hints in your comments brings up marketing by Anthropic "data you sent to one company is being sent to another without your knowledge or consent!" Anthropic also states this without any evidence, but I'm not suggesting it's not true!
I am so glad we never see stories against Anthropic/OpenAI claiming that! Thankfully we don't even have to search, critical thinking is enough to know that Anthropic/OpenAI are responsible data sovereign and others are not.
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> We have actual evidence of DeepSeek using stolen credit cards
Do we? Anthropic made allegations, but have they substantiated them?
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I'm not sure makes sense to white knight for openAI and Anthropic. There are no good guys here.
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I don’t like OpenAI or Anthropic’s attitude towards the law but this whataboutism.
Completely fake. Those companies used relay stations, or third party gateways, to access Anthropic models. https://x.com/trydotworks/status/2098300730805284961?s=20
Yes, routing your customers through relays is probably illegal and certainly violates any expectation a business using your API might have.
I don't think that X post from someone that sells relays is meaningful. Obviously Anthropic is aware of what relays are, they aren't dumb enough to conflate relays with DeepSeek.