Comment by drrotmos

3 years ago

> Would I rather work on this all day instead of a laptop?

That really is the $3,500 question. Can I see myself preferring to work streaming my Mac's screen to a Vision Pro for my IDE, having and things like Slack and e-mail off to the side running on the headset? I don't know, but if I can, this seems worth it to me.

All day is the key component. Most VR headsets recommend taking breaks every half hour, which isn't just a "cover your ass" warning. I know I can't use my personal headset for much longer without feeling woozy after I take it off.

By comparison, I'm at my laptop for 7+ hours just for work. I would need to see compelling evidence that the Vision Pro is safe and comfortable to use for that long before I'd even consider replacing my laptop. And if it can't replace the computers or displays I use, then it's just a $3,500 gimmick.

  • To be fair you are supposed to get up, walk around, and refocus your eyes on something far away every 20 mins or so no matter what computer you are using.

    • But that isn't fair, since we know a vast majority of all-day computer users don't do this. The impact that a screen inches from your eyeballs has on you physically is simply higher, although both carry costs.

    • Headsets focus your eyes much further away than desktop monitors.

      Standing and walking, though, they're still going to be important.

  • They say that the battery on that is ~2 hours (?) So probably not for work yet.

  • They did mention that their dual chip pipeline/low latency reduces the "woozy" effects (because it lines up better with what your brain is expecting I guess). It will be interesting to see

These days I've moved over to pomodoro technique to be able to get any work done in the face of WFH distractions and general indifference to my work.

So strapping on immersive goggles for 30m-1h chunks and taking lots of breaks actually fits my current work model perfectly and might improve my productivity.

It all comes down to.. how clear is text?

I think that price tag is not for end consumers, but early adopters/builders. There is going to be a gold rush of "maybe I can make that flashlight app that makes me a millionaire".

Fun times incoming.

  • > maybe I can make that flashlight app

    I wonder if you could make a literal flashlight/headlamp, either by using the front-facing display as a light, or just leveraging the infrared/lidar sensor to make night-vision goggles

A bigger question is – does it support mouse input? Because none of their demos showed it, and without it the headset is basically dead on arrival for any real work.

  • My bigger worry is how I would type, if that's at all possible. My assumption, like the sibling comment notes, is that eye tracking would replace mouse input.

    And I'm not yet typing code by talking to a computer. Maybe AI will work for 'typing' by talking and using copilot or some similar tech, but I've yet to try that and am not that confident that software has caught up to allow me to navigate folders and files within a codebase, edit the code, restart any servers if that's necessary, test (run tests, or visit a page, or send a curl request), post a pull request, etc. All of the disjoint steps I need to do to work, which change depending on the task, would need to work confidently in a system like this for me to switch over. And if speech is the way forward, I think my wife is going to be pretty upset with me since I WFH.

    • They're positioning this as a productivity product. You'll probably be able to just use a keyboard. Get ready to learn to type without looking at the keys I guess, but I think most people already can with only a few issues.

      Imo most useful case for this is watching youtube in bed, I'd just keep a bluetooth keyboard/mouse on my nightstand.

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  • The demo I saw showed a guy at a standing desk, using a Magic Keyboard and Magic Trackpad. I remember I grimaced thinking what his shoulders must feel like typing with his hands so close together on that tiny, shitty little keyboard. It made me think of little T-Rex arms.

    • The keys on the magic keyboard (and therefore hand positions) are no closer together than on other keyboards. It just doesn't have the numeric keypad part.

      If you want an ergonomic keyboard with a gap in the middle, any bluetooth keyboard will work with a Mac, iPhone or iPad, so I imagine it would with this too.

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  • Maybe they will sell you an iGlove )in the future) to go along with this so that you can type / click on your virtual keyboard & mouse

    • They've already made it clear that you can do that without a glove... (as well as optionally using physical devices instead).

> That really is the $3,500 question.

For me the question rather is: is being able to work from the sofa a couple of hours a day without having to stare at a small screen worth $3.5k? Certainly.

  • Maybe I am in the minority, but I have no problem using my laptop on the couch for a few hours. It's quite comfortable.

    • it's not about if you can but if you should

      you should at least take a brake where you use your legs every hour or more often because if not it will noticeable increase the chance of blot clots in your veins and in turn stuff like heart attacks (long term wrong behavior leading to increased risk over the long term, no relevant per-case risk)

      similar you should change the focus distance of you eyes often enough as it does reduce eye strain (similar light conditioning in your room) and the easiest way to do it is to look not at your screen e.g. when standing up and moving around (and if well done maybe the glasses from Apple can simulated depth in a way which does lead to changes in eye focus)

      Having a walking band below your desk and looking around your room outside of the window or similar will also fix this issues quite efficiently, at the cost of being less lazy (and issues for people with certain kind of back issues).

    • It's very comfortable until you've used a VR display (like an NReal Air). You can relax all of the muscles in your body and still get work done.

  • Is the small screen you're referring to your laptop, or the tiny screens in the headset?

    • I'm not a native English speaker so I thought I missed a comma somewhere. But rereading my previous comment I'm rather certain I mean the small screen to be the one of the laptop. Even the 16" model gives only so much space to work with.

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I can 100% see myself preferring working on this thing over a Mac, as long as I don’t need a Mac to host my dev environment.

  • I mean, depending on the work using it as a thin client would make the most sense imo, compiling still takes a toll on the battery life even with m2 magic

It really depends on how the fake screens actually look in use. You need a decent multiple of the number of pixels in the screen you want to emulate on your AR glasses to be able to pull it off well and so far we haven't really gotten it. I do not see myself getting these till they're a third or less the price either unless they're issued to me for work for some reason.

Anytime its on your face, you could be working.

Front and center, your work. anytime, anywhere. depending on how its implemented you can't get away. Hope they include a power button.

But 2 hours of battery life is a good amount of work, though it seems short somehow. Nice to know there is a limit on it taking over your time.

The key question is if this thing will stay cool enough to be comfortable.

Why?

Because if well done I get my reasonable high multi monitor like setup everywhere I want, no matter weather I'm sitting or lying or on the train or at home.

Fun thing is if you just skim the article it looks as if they copied https://simulavr.com/ :=) (They didn't this was developed independent of each other and Apple put some tweaks in it which they claim no one else did and gave it a new name and claim they are the first, like always.)

Exactly. You know it is worth it when corp pays for the gadgets ;)

I mean, how terribly over-priced is the Mac, and yet...